>>> HELLO, EVERYONE, AND WELCOME TO "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY."

HERE IS WHAT IS COMING UP OR DO YOU BELIEVE?

A U.S.-MADE CAR THAT WOULD BE MORE EXPENSIVE?

>> YES.

FOR SURE.

>> NEW STEEL TARIFFS RAMP UP, PRESIDENT TRUMP'S TRADE WAR.

A CLOSER LOOK AT A CANADIAN COMPANY IMPACTED, AND HOW TARIFFS WILL HURT AMERICANS.

>>> THEN, TO A FRONT-LINE STATE IN THIS ECONOMIC BATTLE.

KENTUCKY GOVERNOR ANDY BESHEAR JOINS THE PROGRAM.

>>> ALSO AHEAD -- >> I'M SCARED.

ALL I WANT TO DO IS TALK ABOUT THE TRUTH.

>> BLACK BOX DIARIES, OSCAR- NOMINATED DOCUMENTARY ABOUT THE SEXUAL ASSAULT CASE THAT SHOCKED JAPAN.

I'M JOINED BY THE WOMAN AT THE HEART OF THE CASE, WHO ALSO DIRECTED THE DOCUMENTARY.

>>> AND -- >> THE POWER GRAB BY TECH COMPANIES AND THE EXPENSE OF DEMOCRACY OFTEN HAPPENS IN LESS VISIBLE WAYS THAN WHAT WE ARE SEEING NOW.

>> IS THE U.S.

IN THE MIST OF A TECH COUP?

FORMER TECH POLITICIAN, DUTCH POLITICIAN, RAISES THE ALARM WITH SERENA BASSON.

>> "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT, JIM ATWOOD, AND LESLIE WILLIAMS, CANDACE KING WIER, THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LAYLA AND MICKEY STRAUSS, MARK J. BLESSIN, FILM AND M. DUGSTINO, PETERSON AND JOE GANZ COONEY FUND, CHARLES ROSENBLUM, QUEUE AND PATRICIA U.N., COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.

BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG, JEFFREY KATZ , AND BETH ROGERS, AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION AND VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

THANK YOU.

>>> WARM WELCOME TO THE STUDIO FROM NEW YORK.

SITTING IN FOR CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, PRESIDENT TRUMP LIKES TO SAY, QUOTE, TARIFFS ARE THE MOST BEAUTIFUL WORD BUT ARE THINGS ABOUT TO GET UGLY?

CHINA IS RETALIATING TARIFFS ON $14 BILLION FOR U.S. IMPORTS COMING INTO EFFECT TODAY.

JUST WANTED WEEK AFTER REACHING AN AGREEMENT TO DELAY A TRADE IS BOUND WITH NEIGHBORS, CANADA AND MEXICO, THE PRESIDENT ANNOUNCED THIS ON SUNDAY.

>> ALSO ANNOUNCING STEEL TARIFFS MONDAY.

MONDAY, YEAH.

>> [ INAUDIBLE QUESTION ] >> EVERYBODY.

STEEL.

>> INCLUDING CANADA?

>> ANY STEEL COMPANY TO THE UNITED STATES IS GOING TO HAVE A 25% TARIFF.

>> WHAT ABOUT ALUMINUM, SIR?

>> ALUMINUM TOO.

>> AMERICA'S LARGEST SUPPLIER OF STEEL, IT IS SOMETHING THAT COULD HIT CANADA PARTICULARLY HARD.NOW, THE WIELDING OF TARIFFS IS A BLUDGEON, SENDING JITTERS THROUGH COMPANIES IN CANADA.

OF COURSE, IT IS SOMETHING THAT I SAW FIRSTHAND IN THIS REPORT FROM THE MANUFACTURING HEARTLAND OF ONTARIO.

PEOPLE EVEN TOLD ME, THEY ARE CHANGING HOW THEY VIEW THEIR AMERICAN NEIGHBORS.

LISTEN.

IT'S ON THIS FACTORY FLOOR IN CANADA DONALD TRUMP'S DEMANDS FOR FAIR TRADE ARE BEING TESTED.

WHAT ARE THESE OVER HERE?

>> SILVER.

>> THESE ARE PARTS FOR THE SILVERADO, AGM TRUCK MADE IN CANADA, U.S., AND MEXICO.

THEY'RE MADE BY RAM.

>> BIZARRE 1000 TIMES, PRESS -- >> GLOBAL AUTO-PARTS SUPPLIER WITH THOUSANDS OF WORKERS IN ALL THREE COUNTRIES.

TRUMP TARIFFS WOULD STRIKE AT THE VERY HEART OF THIS BUSINESS AND ITS WORKERS IN NORTH AMERICA.

EXECUTIVE CHAIRMAN ROB WILL DeBOER.

PRESIDENT TRUMP WOULD SAY, WHY MEXICO, WHY CAN'T YOU MAKE IT ALL IN THE U.S.?

>> I DON'T KNOW ANYONE IN OUR COMPANY THAT WANTS TARIFFS BETWEEN CANADA, THE U.S., AND MEXICO, BECAUSE WE WORK VERY WELL AS A UNIT, TAKE CARE OF OUR PEOPLE EVERYWHERE, MAKE GREAT PARTS IN EVERY JURISDICTION, AND QUITE FRANKLY, WE BENEFIT FROM THAT.

WE HAVE GOT SOME GREAT PLANTS IN MEXICO AND THE UNITED STATES AND CANADA.

>> DO YOU BELIEVE A U.S.-MADE CAR, THEN, WOULD BE MORE EXPENSIVE?

>> YES.

FOR SURE.

FOR SURE.

>> THAT IS THE MATH, HE SAYS, CALCULATION MADE EVERY DAY, HERE, WITH THE THREAT OF TARIFFS HANGING OVER ONE OF THE MOST PRIZED MANUFACTURING INDUSTRIES ON THE CONTINENT.

CANADA'S AUTO INDUSTRY DIRECTLY EMPLOYS AT LEAST 130,000 PEOPLE IN DOZENS OF TOWNS AND CITIES, INCLUDING THIS FACILITY IN VANN, OUT TERRIO, OUTSIDE OF TORONTO.

THEY DEPEND ON THESE STABLE JOBS, AS DO WORKERS AT THIS FACILITY IN THE U.S. STATE OF KENTUCKY.

>> I WILL PUT MY U.S. HAT ON.

RIGHT?

BECAUSE WE ARE AN AMERICAN SUPPLIER.

WE ARE A CANADIAN SUPPLIER, WE ARE A MEXICAN SUPPLIER, BUT WE HAD TWICE AS MANY PEOPLE IN THE UNITED STATES AS WE DO IN CANADA, AND IN A NUMBER OF COMMUNITIES, WE ARE THE LARGEST EMPLOYER.

SO, KENTUCKY, JONESVILLE, MICHIGAN, AND OTHERS, WE'RE BIG DEAL.

WE'RE BIG DEAL LOCALLY, WE TAKE CARE OF A LOT OF PEOPLE.

I WOULD SAY, A LOT OF THOSE PEOPLE PROBABLY VOTED FOR PRESIDENT TRUMP.

THEY LIKED HIS MESSAGE TO LOWER INFLATION, MORE JOBS, STRONGER ECONOMY, BUT WITH TARIFFS AND SO FORTH, THEY'RE GETTING HIGHER INFLATION, LESS JOBS, WEAKER ECONOMY.

>> DESPITE THAT PITCH, EVEN EMPLOYEES HERE KNOW WHAT THEY ARE UP AGAINST IN THE OVAL OFFICE.

SOME TOLD US, THEY APPROVE OF CANADA'S STANDING UP TO THE THREAT.

>> GOING TO HURT ANYHOW, HONESTLY, EITHER DEAL WITH IT NOW OR IN THE FUTURE.

>> IT IS NOT JUST CANADA.

TRUMP IS CHALLENGING THE VERY TEMPLATE OF FREE TRADE RIGHT AROUND THE WORLD.

THE EUROPEAN UNION CAN SEE WHAT IS COMING THEIR WAY.

ONE OF THE LARGEST TRADE DEFICITS WITH THE U.S., AND, TOO, SAYS IT WILL RESPOND FIRMLY TO ANY TARIFFS, BUT IT IS TRUMP'S TOUGH TALK ABOUT AN ECONOMIC TAKEOVER OF CANADA THAT CANNOT BE RECONCILED.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO SEE CANADA BECOME OUR 51st STATE.

>> TRIGGERED AN UNCOMMON ANTI- AMERICAN BACKLASH IN CANADA THAT MAY HAVE LEGS, BOOING THE U.S. ANTHEM, BOYCOTTING AMERICAN PRODUCTS, ALL OF IT, SO FAR, SEEMS TO HAVE STAYING POWER.

>> I THINK IT IS RIDICULOUS.

WE HAVE BEEN FRIENDS FOR YEARS, TRADED FOR YEARS, AND THEN, ALL OF A SUDDEN, THIS HAPPENS.

>> FROM THE EXECUTIVES AND THE NORTH AMERICAN WORKERS, TARIFFS COULD STILL BE A REALITY WITHIN WEEKS, PUTTING AT RISK A PROFITABLE BUSINESS AND GOOD PAYING JOBS IN THE U.S. AND BEYOND.

THEY ARE ASKING PRESIDENT TRUMP, WHY MESS WITH THAT.

AS YOU HEARD THERE, THE IMPACT OF THE TARIFFS ISN'T JUST OUTSIDE OF AMERICA'S BORDER, BUT VERY MUCH WITHIN THE BORDERS OF AMERICA, POTENTIALLY HITTING STATES LIKE KENTUCKY VERY HARD.

JOINING ME NOW FOR THIS AND SO MUCH MORE IS THE DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR OF KENTUCKY, ANDY BESHEAR.

WANT TO WELCOME YOU TO THE PROGRAM.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> ALL RIGHT, THESE ARE NUMBERS I DO NOT HAVE TO REMIND YOU OF, BUT KENTUCKY EXPORTED MORE THAN $9 BILLION IN GOODS TO CANADA IN 2023 ALONE, NEARLY WANTED/PORTRAIT OF THE STATE'S TOTAL GOODS EXPORTED.

YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE MENTIONED BEFORE, KENTUCKY'S TWO SENATORS, MITCH McCONNELL AND RAND PAUL HAVE BOTH SAID, LOOK, THESE TARIFFS DO NOT MAKE SENSE.

FIRST, LET US KNOW WHAT KIND OF AN IMPACT YOU BELIEVE IT WILL MAKE ON YOUR STATE, YOU KNOW, AND YOU HEARD ME SPEAK ABOUT THE COMPANY.

YOU SAW THE COMPANY IN THAT REPORT -- I KNOW YOU HAVE BEEN TO THEIR FACILITIES IN KENTUCKY -- WHAT DO YOU SAY TO PEOPLE IN YOUR COMMUNITIES WHO I KNOW WILL TELL YOU, WE'LL BRING MORE OF THOSE CANADIAN JOBS TO KENTUCKY?

>> I THINK PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITIES ARE NOW SEEING HOW DAMAGING THESE TARIFFS ARE GOING TO BE.

TARIFFS ARE GOING TO INCREASE THE PRICE OF EVERYDAY GOODS ON ALL AMERICANS, WHICH IS THE ANTITHESIS, THE OPPOSITE, OF WHY THEY MAY HAVE VOTED FOR DONALD TRUMP.I BELIEVE DONALD TRUMP IS CURRENTLY THE PRESIDENT, BECAUSE THE LAST GROUP OF MOVABLE VOTERS THOUGHT HE WOULD BE MORE FOCUSED ON BRINGING DOWN PRICES THAN HIS OPPONENT, BUT HE HAS DONE EVERYTHING BUT THAT LOOK AT HIS NUMBER OF EO WHO'S ON CULTURE WAR ISSUES, SO MANY MORE THAN ANYTHING ON THE ECONOMY.

YOU ARE RIGHT, WHEN YOU LOOK AT MY STATE, CANADA IS OUR NUMBER ONE TREATING PARTNER, ALMOST 1/4 OF ALL OF OUR EXPORTS GO TO CANADA, AND CANADA HAS BEEN SUCH A GOOD PARTNER TO THE UNITED STATES, AND A GOOD FRIEND IN VIRTUALLY EVERYTHING WE HAVE DONE.

NOT ONLY DOES IT NOT MAKE ECONOMIC SENSE, BUT IT IS SENDING THE WRONG MESSAGE TO THE WORLD.

LET ME BREAK IT DOWN AS SIMPLY AS I CAN, TARIFFS ON CANADA WILL INCREASE PRICES AT THE PUMP, TARIFFS ON MEXICO WILL INCREASE PRICES AT THE GROCERY STORE, AND BOTH OF THOSE WILL HIT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HARD.

>> GOVERNOR BESHEAR, IS THE PRESIDENT OR ANYONE AROUND HIM -- EVEN REPUBLICANS -- EVEN SOMETHING?

TWO OF THREE OF ALL KENTUCKIANS VOTED FOR DONALD TRUMP, AND HIS APPROVAL RATING SEEMS TO BE HOLDING.

>> DONALD TRUMP TALKED ABOUT A LOT ON THE CAMPAIGN TRAIL.

HE DIDN'T TALK ABOUT RAISING PRICES ON THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, TALKED ABOUT THE EXACT OPPOSITE .I THINK SOME PEOPLE THOUGHT THAT HE WOULD BE TRYING TO MAKE DEALS TO DECREASE PRICES INSTEAD OF USING OUR ECONOMY AS A BARGAINING CHIP WITH THESE TARIFFS TO TRY TO GET NONECONOMIC CONCESSIONS.

YOU SAID EARLIER -- AND I'M GRATEFUL -- SENATOR MITCH McCONNELL AND SENATOR RAND PAUL ARE TWO REPUBLICAN SENATORS SPEAKING OUT AGAINST TARIFFS.

YES, RAND PAUL, MITCH McCONNELL, DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR OF KENTUCKY, ALL AGREE TARIFFS ARE A BAD IDEA FOR A SIMPLE REASON.

TARIFFS ARE A REALLY BAD IDEA.

>> IF YOU ARE GETTING THROUGH TO THE PRESIDENT YET, OR EVEN THOSE TWO REPUBLICAN SENATORS, YOU KNOW, WE WERE LOOKING IN MY REPORT ON THE FACT THAT AMERICAN WHISKEY, BOURBON FROM KENTUCKY, BEING TAKEN OFF THE SHELVES.

THAT WAS HALTED FOR NOW, BUT OBVIOUSLY, THE THREAT IS THERE IF THIS TRADE WAR CONTINUES.

DO YOU BELIEVE BUSINESS PEOPLE FROM KENTUCKY ARE NOW LOOKING AT THE PRESIDENT'S MOVES ON TARIFFS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY, AND COULD THEY POSSIBLY GET THROUGH TO THE PRESIDENT?

>> I HOPE THEY CAN, AND THEY ARE ABSOLUTELY SEEING THE HARM OF TARIFFS.

THAT IS EVERYTHING FROM OUR BOURBON INDUSTRY -- YOU KNOW, 95% OF THE WORLD'S BOURBON IS MADE IN KENTUCKY.

THE BOURBON WORTH DRINKING IS ALL MADE IN KENTUCKY.

>> NOTED.

NOTED.

>> AT THE SAME TIME, YOU LOOK AT 95 -- 30 LIKE YOU TALKED ABOUT -- PERCENTAGE POINTS THAT TRUMP WON KENTUCKY -- BUT 0 IS THE NUMBER OF BOTTLES OF KENTUCKY BOURBON THAT CAN BE ON THE SHELVES IN CANADIAN LIQUOR STORES.

HOW THAT WOULD HIT OUR PEOPLE, HOW IT WOULD HIT A REALLY PROUD INDUSTRY, IT COULD BE DEVASTATING, BUT THEN, LOOK AT OUR SMALL BUSINESSES.

THEY ARE JUST AS WORRIED LOOK AT WHERE THEIR SUPPLIES COME FROM, WHEN THEY LOOK AT YEARS OF INFLATION, ALREADY CAUSING THEM DIFFICULTY.

THEY'RE LOOKING AT THIS, THEY'RE SAYING, WHY ON EARTH ARE WE THREATENING TARIFFS ON A PLACE LIKE CANADA IN A WAY THAT CAN MAKE LIFE TOUGHER FOR US IN AMERICA.

>> YEAH, THE PRESIDENT DID OUTLINE THIS ISSUE WITH FENTANYL AT THE BORDER.

CANADA IS SAYING THAT IT IS GOING TO SPEND UPWARDS OF 1 BILLION TO POLICE THE BORDER, IT WILL APPOINT A DRUG OR FENTANYL'S ARE AT THE BORDER THERE.

OBVIOUSLY, THIS IS A TOPIC NEAR AND DEAR TO YOU, ESPECIALLY GIVING THE AFFECTS OF THE OPIOID CRISIS IN KENTUCKY, AS ATTORNEY GENERAL YOU HAD A LOT TO DO WITH THIS.

LOOK, THE FACTS ARE CLEAR AND CANADA, REALLY INFINITESIMAL WHAT IT CARRIES ACROSS THE BORDER INTO THE UNITED STATES COMPARED TO MEXICO.

AT THE SAME TIME, THOUGH, DOES THE PRESIDENT HAVE A POINT, THAT MORE CAN BE DONE, ESPECIALLY IF YOU LOOK AT THE ROOTS OF TRAFFICKING, AND THE FACT THAT YOU WANT CANADA TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT BEFORE IT IS A PROBLEM?

>> I BELIEVE THAT BORDER SECURITY IS NATIONAL SECURITY, AND I BELIEVE WE HAVE TO HAVE STRONG BORDERS.

LIKE YOU MENTIONED, AS ATTORNEY GENERAL, I HAVE SUED MORE OPIOID MANUFACTURERS THAN ANY OTHER AG IN THE NATION BECAUSE WE WERE HIT THE HARDEST.

IN KENTUCKY, WE HAVE ALL LOST PEOPLE WE LOVE AND WE CARE ABOUT.

FIRST, THROUGH OPIOID ADDICTION, NOW, FENTANYL BEING AS POWERFUL AS IT IS, BUT CANADA IS NOT THE CAUSE FOR THAT.

THEY ARE NOT.

YOU LOOK AT THE NUMBERS, AND WHAT WE ARE DOING IS THREATENING A STRONG, IMPORTANT RELATIONSHIP FOR OUR NATIONAL SECURITY, AND FOR OUR ECONOMY.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, AGAIN, I BELIEVE THE PRESIDENT WAS ELECTED TO BRING DOWN PRICES.

IF HIS ACTIONS CAUSE AN INCREASE, MAKING IT HARDER FOR THE AMERICAN PEOPLE TO PAY BILLS AT THE END OF THE MONTH, I THINK THERE IS GOING TO BE A BIG FEELING OF BETRAYAL THAT IS GOING TO COME ON PRETTY EARLY.

>> YET, PRESIDENT IS SAYING, LOOK, IF IT DOESN'T HAPPEN -- YOUR BELIEF THAT IT DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING OR MUCH TO DO WITH THE ISSUE OF FENTANYL AT THE BORDER -- IS IT THE 51st STATE QUESTION?

JUSTIN TRUDEAU THINKS THAT IS A REAL THING.

DO YOU BELIEVE IT IS A REAL THING?

DO YOU THINK THE PRESIDENT WOULD GO THAT FAR?

>> IT'S ELECTED PRESIDENT BRINGS IT UP A LOT, BUT I THINK IT IS SILLY.

CANADA IS A STRONG ALLY, IT IS A PROUD COUNTRY, IT IS MARCHED INTO SO MANY DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE WORLD RIGHT NEXT TO THE UNITED STATES.

SO IMPORTANT FOR OUR ECONOMY.

WE HAVE ALWAYS BEEN ABLE TO WORK OUT DIFFERENCES LIKE FRIENDS AND LIKE ALLIES, AND I HAVE GREAT CONCERN ABOUT THE IMPACT THIS COULD HAVE ON OUR LONG-STANDING RELATIONSHIP.

SO, TO THE PEOPLE OF CANADA, THIS IS NOT HOW THE PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES FEEL.

THIS IS WHAT OUR CURRENT PRESIDENT IS TALKING ABOUT.

THERE ARE A LOT MORE THAN ONE PRESIDENT.

>> I WANT TO TURN TO THE EFFECTS OF THE EXECUTIVE ORDERS IN THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, IN A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN TWO WEEKS HERE, 40% OF KENTUCKY'S BUDGET -- DON'T HAVE TO REMIND YOU -- COME FROM FEDERAL GRANT FUNDING THAT IS ABOUT $22 BILLION.

IT GOES TO EVERYTHING HELPING NEW MOTHERS, CHILDCARE, YOUR MEDICAL FACILITIES.

THERE WAS A DATE -- IT WAS A LOT OF CONFUSION THE FIRST WEEK OF THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION -- HOW DID THAT AFFECT KENTUCKY, AND ARE YOU WORRIED IT WILL AFFECT THE CRUCIAL FUNDS GOING FORWARD?

>> YEAH, THAT DAY WAS DIFFICULT.

IT SHOULD HAVE NEVER HAPPENED.

THEY SHUT OFF MEDICAID FOR MOST OF THAT DAY.

THAT IS HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF KENTUCKIANS, AND TENS OF MILLIONS OF AMERICANS THAT COULD HAVE BEEN GOING IN FOR DOCTORS APPOINTMENTS, THAT COULD HAVE BEEN WAITING ON A CRITICAL SURGERY, AND THE DAMAGE THAT COULD HAVE CAUSED IF IT HAD CONTINUED FURTHER WOULD HAVE BEEN MEASURED IN HUMAN LIVES.

YOU LOOK AT OTHER GRANTS THAT ARE OUT THERE ON RESEARCH AND WHAT THEY'RE ABOUT TO DO, THE UNIVERSITY THEY'RE TRYING TO FIND THE NEXT DRUG THAT CAN HELP SOMEONE WITH DIABETES, THE NEXT BREAKTHROUGH IN CANCER.

YOU LOOK AT THREATENED FUNDING THAT COULD DRY UP DOLLARS FOR SPECIAL EDUCATION WITHIN OUR STATE.THESE ARE ALL REALLY IMPORTANT PROGRAMS.

ARE THERE PROBLEMS IN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT?

SURE DOES THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT NEEDED TO BE FIXED?

YES.

BUT WHAT YOU SEE RIGHT NOW IS AN ATTEMPT TO BREAK IT.

THAT IS WRONG.

THERE ARE TOO MANY PEOPLE OUT THERE COUNTING ON THESE PROGRAMS NOT TO GIVE THEM A HANDOUT, BUT TO GIVE THEM A HAND UP.

THE ECONOMY AS WE SEE IT RIGHT NOW, WE CAN PLACE PEOPLE IN GOOD JOBS WHEN WE GIVE THEM JUST THAT EXTRA BIT OF HEALTH.

>> A POINTED QUESTION, GOVERNOR, WHAT CAN YOU DO ABOUT IT?

IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE MUCH IS BEING DONE, AND THAT THREAT STILL HANGS OVER YOUR STATE AND OTHERS.

>> CERTAINLY, A COURT ACTION IS ONE STEP THAT MANY AG'S HAVE TAKEN.

YOU ARE GOING TO SEE US JOIN MANY OF THOSE COURT ACTIONS MOVING FORWARD.

WHEN CONGRESS PASSES A LAW THAT CREATES A PROGRAM, THEY FIND THAT PROGRAM.

THE PRESIDENT CAN'T CHOOSE TO NOT CARRY -- IT IS HIS CONSTITUTIONAL DUTY TO DO SO.

I KNOW, BECAUSE WHEN I WAS ATTORNEY GENERAL, OUR GOVERNOR TRIED THE SAME THING.

HE TRIED TO DO CUT TO OUR UNIVERSITIES.

THEY WERE IN OPPOSITION TO WHAT OUR GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAD DONE, I SUED, AND WE WON.

THIS PRESIDENT HAS EXCEEDED HIS LEGAL AUTHORITY.

MANY OF HIS ACTIONS ARE VIOLATING THE CONSTITUTION.

WE'RE GOING TO BE THERE, IN THE COURTS, TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ARE STANDING UP FOR THE SEPARATION OF POWERS, BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, THEY WERE STANDING UP FOR OUR PEOPLE.

THIS COULD ALL GET CAUGHT UP IN THE LEGAL FRAMEWORK THAT IS SO IMPORTANT TO OUR COUNTRY, BUT WHAT IS MOST CRITICAL IS WHAT THESE CUTS OR FREEZES WOULD DO TO HARD-WORKING AMERICANS THAT RELY ON CERTAIN PROGRAMS.

>> SO MUCH OF THAT DAMAGE WOULD BE DONE BEFORE PEOPLE REALIZE WHAT IS HAPPENING.

I WANT TO GO BACK TO THE GUARD RAIL, WRITTEN IN THE CONSTITUTION, IN TERMS OF THE POWERS OF THE GOVERNMENT IN THE UNITED STATES ARE DIVIDED.

YET, SUNDAY, VICE PRESIDENT J.D.

VANCE, SAYING, DOCTORS AREN'T ALLOWED TO CONTROL THE EXECUTIVES' LEGITIMATE POWER.

OPENLY QUESTIONING JUDICIARY'S POWER IN THE COURT RULINGS.

AS YOU SAID, YOU WORKED WITH THE UNIVERSITY OF REGINA LAW AS A GRADUATE, YOU ARE A FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL.

WHAT HAPPENED THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION BASICALLY THUMBS ITS NOSE AT THESE COURT RULINGS?

>> J.D.

VANCE WASN'T LISTENING AT YALE LAW SCHOOL, APPARENTLY, BECAUSE HE KNOWS BETTER.

HE OBVIOUSLY KNOWS BETTER.

THEY'RE TRYING TO PUSH THROUGH, THINKING THAT THE COURTS WON'T STOP THEM AND WON'T ENFORCE THEIR VOTERS -- I HAVE FAITH THAT THEY WILL, AND FOR THE FUTURE OF OUR AMERICAN DEMOCRACY, THEY NEED TO.

DIFFERENT TIMES, EXECUTIVES IN FRONT, THE COURTS HAVE TRIED TO OVERREACH WITH CONGRESS, BUT THE COURTS HAVE TO BE THERE TO SEPARATE POWERS, FOR THE STRUCTURE OF GOVERNMENT THAT HAS MADE THE UNITED STATES THE BEACON TO THE WORLD FOR SO MANY YEARS.

IN THE END, THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION NEEDS TO TAKE A BREATH AND KNOCK IT OFF.

THEY HAVE SO MUCH AUTHORITY, THEY CAN DO A WHOLE LOT WITHOUT TRYING TO TRAMPLE OVER THAT SEPARATION OF POWERS, WITHOUT TRYING TO ILLEGALLY CUT DIFFERENT PROGRAMS THAT ARE SO IMPORTANT.

AGAIN, THEY GET TO THE WORK OF FIXING THINGS, BUT WHAT THEY CAN'T DO IS BREAK THINGS IN DIRECT CONTRADICTION TO STATUTE.

>> AGAIN, IF THEY DO NOT ADHERE TO ANY OF THE COURT RULINGS, WHAT CAN DEMOCRATIC GOVERNORS OR THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY DO?

>> WELL, IF WE REACH THAT POINT, WE'LL REACH THAT POINT, BUT I BELIEVE THAT THEY WILL ABIDE BY COURT ORDERS AND CREATE MORE OF A CONSTITUTIONAL CRISIS THAN WE HAVE CERTAINLY SEEN AT ANY POINT IN MY LIFETIME.

WE ARE SEEING THEM OBEY, AT LEAST, OBEY, FOR THE MOST PART, THE ORDERS THAT STOPPED THE FREEZING OF FUNDING.

WE ARE SEEING THEM OBEY OTHER ORDERS THAT ARE OUT THERE.

FEDERAL COURT HAS A LOT OF SANCTIONS THAT THEY CAN PUT IN PLACE.

WE ARE GOING TO NEED OUR JUDICIARY TO DO THEIR JOB.

LET ME JUST ADD, CONGRESS SHOULD BE DOING ITS JOB TOO.

THE MEMBERS OF CONGRESS, REPUBLICAN AND DEMOCRATIC, TAKE AN OATH TO THE CONSTITUTION.

THEY SHOULD BE STANDING UP FOR THEIR AUTHORITY AS CONGRESS.

THE FACT THAT THE REPUBLICAN MAJORITY IS JUST ROLLING OVER AND SAYING, YOU CAN IGNORE ANYTHING WE HAVE PASSED, THAT IS AN ABDICATION OF DUTY.

THAT IS AN ABDICATION OF THEIR ROLE IN THIS GOVERNMENT.

IT IS TIME FOR THEM TO STEP UP, TOO AND SAY, SURE, WE SUPPORT YOU, WE ARE BEHIND YOU, PRESIDENT TRUMP, IF THEY ARE, BUT YOU HAVE YOUR JOB, WE HAVE OURS, YOU CAN DO OUR JOB, WE ARE GOING TO STAND UP FOR OUR ROLE IN THE GOVERNMENT.

>> THAT, AGAIN, MAY BE UP TO THE PRESSURE THAT VOTERS THEMSELVES PUT ON THOSE REPRESENTATIVES.

I WANTED TO.

>>> OUT, NOTICED YOU WERE IN A LOCAL SUPERMARKET THE OTHER DAY.

EVERYONE.EGG PRICES -- $7 FOR A CARTON IS CRAZY -- PROJECTED TO RISE 20% MORE THIS YEAR ACCORDING TO THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE.

DEMOCRATS POINT OUT THAT TRUMP WON AGENDA WILL DO NOTHING TO LOWER PRICES.

YOU ARTICULATED THAT THE LAST FEW MINUTES AS WELL, YET, SOME SAY REPUBLICANS USED THIS CULTURE WAR ON SO MANY ISSUES TO CONVINCE THEIR VOTERS TO ACTUALLY VOTE AGAINST THEIR OWN ECONOMIC INTERESTS.

WHAT IS THE TIPPING POINT YOU SEE?

YOU KNOW AS WELL AS I DO, A LOT OF THE VOTERS THAT VOTED FOR YOU, AS WELL AS DONALD TRUMP, DO BELIEVE THAT WHAT HE HAS DONE, VIS-A-VIS THE CULTURAL WAR, IS WARRANTED.

>> I BELIEVE I MAY DEMOCRATIC GOVERNOR IN WHAT IS PERCEIVED AS A RED STATE.

DONALD TRUMP ULTIMATELY WON IN KENTUCKY.

THEY BELIEVE THAT WE WERE MORE FOCUSED ON THE EVERYDAY CONCERNS, THEIR JOB, WHETHER OR NOT THEY MAKE IT UP TO SUPPORT THEIR FAMILIES, THEIR NEXT DOCTOR APPOINTMENT, ROADS AND BRIDGES THEY DRIVE EVERY DAY, THE SCHOOL THEY DROP THEIR KIDS OFF AT, PUBLIC SAFETY IN THEIR COMMUNITIES.

I BELIEVE THAT THOSE LAST GROUP OF VOTERS WERE CONVINCED -- I DON'T THINK RIGHTFULLY -- WERE CONVINCED THAT THE FORMER VICE PRESIDENT WAS DISTRACTED BY CULTURE WAR ISSUES.

WHAT WE SEE NOW IS DONALD TRUMP SEEMS OBSESSED BY THEM AGAIN, HE HAS GOT MORE EO'S ON TRANSITORY DEI ISSUES THAN HE HAS ON THE ECONOMY.

I THINK WE SAW A RECENT POLL WITH 66% OF AMERICANS SAYING HE HASN'T DONE ENOUGH TO LOWER PRICES.

MOST PRESIDENTS GET A PERIOD OF TIME WHERE PEOPLE TRY TO GIVE THEM THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT, BUT THESE RISKY GAMES HE IS PLAYING WITH TARIFFS, WITH THE PRICES OF SO MANY GOODS, ALREADY SAYING, YOU CAN ONLY TALK ABOUT EGG PRICES SO MUCH, I THINK WAS A QUOTE THAT HE SAID, IS TURNING A LOT OF AMERICANS OFF.

TO ALL AMERICANS OUT THERE, THE BEST WAY TO HELP MAKE SURE WE GET THIS RIGHT IT IS USE YOUR VOICE.

WITH SOCIAL MEDIA RIGHT NOW, IF YOU ARE IN THE GROCERY STORE, PRICES ARE GOING UP, MAKE SURE YOU GET IT OUT THERE.

MAKE SURE YOU RAISE YOUR VOICE ABOUT YOUR CONCERNS, BECAUSE THIS IS ULTIMATELY YOUR GOVERNMENT.

>> AND DO NOTE, AS WELL, THE DEMOCRATIC STRATEGY ON THOSE CULTURE WARS.

WE WILL CONTINUE TO FOLLOW ON THE DEMOCRATIC RESPONSE TO THIS, AS WELL AS YOURS.

ANDY BESHEAR, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

APPRECIATE IT.

>> THANK YOU.

>>> NEXT, NOW TO A CRITICALLY ACCLAIMED DOCUMENTARY THAT MERGES THE POWER OF JOURNALISM WITH THE JAPANESE ME TOO MOVEMENT.

"BLACK BOX DIARIES" TELLS A HARROWING STORY OF SHIORI ITO, JOURNALIST INVESTIGATING HER OWN SEXUAL ASSAULTS, OFFERING A SHOCKING EXPOSE OF SEXISM IN JUSTICE AND THE TIES THAT BIND IN JAPAN'S POLITICAL CULTURE.

>> I AM SCARED, BUT ALL I WANT TO DO IS TALK ABOUT THE TRUTH.

[ SPEAKING IN A NON-ENGLISH LANGUAGE ] MANY PEOPLE ALREADY WITNESSED IT.

>> [ SPEAKING IN A NON-ENGLISH LANGUAGE ] >> OR, THE JUSTICE SYSTEM IS NOT WORKING.

WITHOUT THESE RECORDINGS, THEY WON'T BELIEVE WHAT I HEARD.

>> DIRECTED BY SHIORI ITO HERSELF, THE FILM IS NOMINATED FOR BEST DOCUMENT RE-FEATURE AND NEXT MONTH'S ACADEMY AWARDS.

IT IS STREAMING, NOW, ON PARAMOUNT+ .

SHIORI ITO JOINS THE SHOW, NOW, LIVE FROM LOS ANGELES.

WE WANT TO WARN EVERYONE WATCHING, PARTS OF THIS CONVERSATION, YOU MAY FIND DISTRESSING.

I WANT TO WELCOME YOU TO THE PROGRAM, YOUR FILM IS SO DEEPLY PERSONAL.

THIS WAS, OBVIOUSLY, A LONG AND DIFFICULT JOURNEY FOR YOU.

AS A YOUNG WOMAN, REALLY TRYING, FIGHTING YOUR WAY TO GET SOME OUTCOME OF JUSTICE FOR THE BENEFIT OF OUR AUDIENCE, IN YOUR OWN WORDS, CAN YOU TELL US YOUR STORY?

>> YES.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME.

WHILE IT IS MY STORY OF EXPERIENCE OF SEXUAL VIOLENCE, THIS FILM IS NOT FOCUSING ON WHAT HAPPENED.

IT IS THIS FILM HIGHLIGHTING WHAT HAPPENS AFTER.

HOW DO WE SURVIVE AS A SURVIVOR?

HOW DID I HAVE TO INVESTIGATE MY OWN CASE WHEN POLICE OR JAPANESE MEDIA COULDN'T TOUCH ON THAT?

SO, THE PERSPECTIVE AS A JOURNALIST, BUT ALSO A PERSPECTIVE AS A SURVIVOR OF SEXUAL VIOLENCE >> YEAH, IN PURSUING THOSE TWO THINGS, IN YOUR CAREER AS A JOURNALIST, VERY MUCH AT THE FOREFRONT.

YOU SHOWED FOOTAGE OF THE NIGHT IN 2015 WHEN YOU MET A HIGH PROFILE JOURNALIST FOR SOME CAREER ADVICE.

YOU WERE AN INTERN.

SO MUCH OF US CAN RELATE TO THAT, AN INTERN AT REUTERS AT THE TIME.

WE HEAR IN THE EARLY PHONE CALLS HOW THE INVESTIGATORS JUST DISMISSED YOU AS NOT HAVING ENOUGH EVIDENCE, THAT EVEN WAKING UP DURING THE ACT, AND YOU DESCRIBING THAT TO THEM, IT JUST WASN'T ENOUGH, THEN, YOU DECIDE TO GO PUBLIC TWO YEARS LATER.

I JUST WANT TO SHOW EVERYONE JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE OF THE DOCUMENTARY.

LISTEN.

>> I HAVE TALKED ABOUT THE TRUTH, WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO ME TWO YEARS AGO.

WHICH HAPPENED, I FEEL, WHICH HAS BEEN IGNORED.

THIS COULD BE A BIG CHANGE.

IN MY LIFE, AND SOME OTHERS -- OR MANY OTHERS -- AND, I AM NOT SURE -- I'M SCARED, AND I AM NOT SURE IF I COULD BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THAT, BUT ALL I WANT TO DO IS TALK ABOUT THE TRUTH.

>> SO STARTLED WHEN YOU TOOK THOSE MOMENTS IN THE DOCUMENTARY TO LOOK STRAIGHT INTO THE CAMERA.

IT MUST HAVE BEEN A DIFFICULT DECISION TO GO PUBLIC WITH THIS STORY.

I AM WONDERING HOW YOU ARE DEALING WITH ALL THE FALLOUT, NOW, EVEN THOUGH, OBVIOUSLY, THERE IS A LOT OF ACCLAIM FOR WHAT YOU HAVE DONE AS WELL.

>> FIRSTLY, FOR ME, WAS JUST DOCUMENTING WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN FRONT OF ME, AND I SUSPECT THERE WAS A POSSIBLE COVER-UP.

BUT AFTER TWO YEARS, I DECIDED TO GO PUBLIC BECAUSE I WANTED TO -- US TO REINVESTIGATE THIS CASE -- POSSIBLY ASKING FOR OTHER JOURNALISTS TO ASK THESE TOUGH QUESTION FOR THESE PEOPLE , BUT IT DIDN'T HAPPEN IN THE WAY I HOPED.

SO, THAT'S WHY I JUST HAD TO KEEP DOCUMENTING, AND HONESTLY, I DIDN'T KNOW IF I WANT TO MAKE A FILM THAT TIME, BUT I HAVE TO SAY, IF THERE WAS -- YOU KNOW -- INVESTIGATION AND MEDIA WHO ASKED THESE QUESTIONS STRAIGHTAWAY, DIRECTLY, I DON'T THINK I HAD TO GO THROUGH ALL OF THIS.

SO, IT'S BEEN DIFFICULT JOURNEY, BUT I'M VERY HAPPY NOW WE CAN SHARE THIS STORY TO THE OTHERS, BECAUSE THIS IS JUST ONE EXPERIENCE, ONE OF MY STORY, AND THERE ARE THOUSANDS -- OR MILLIONS MORE -- OUT THERE THAT WE DON'T KNOW THAT HAS BEEN MAY BE COVERED UP OR SILENCED.

>> UNFORTUNATELY, LIKELY MORE.

A 2020 JAPANESE GOVERNMENT SURVEY FOUND THAT 95% -- THE VAST MAJORITY OF SURVIVORS -- THEY JUST NEVER REPORT ANY OF THESE ASSAULTS TO THE POLICE.

YOU KNOW, SOME DON'T TELL ANYONE AT ALL.

OBVIOUSLY, BECAUSE THEY, THEMSELVES, FEEL, DID I DO SOMETHING WRONG, THEY FEEL SHAME.

CAN YOU EXPLAIN THE BARRIERS THAT YOU FACE, THE VERY PERSONAL ONES FOR YOU?

>> WELL, I DON'T THINK THIS IS JUST JAPANESE CULTURE, BUT BECAUSE, YEAH, IN OUR CULTURE, IN SOCIETY, TALKING ABOUT SEXUAL VIOLENCE, AND THERE ARE STRONG STIGMA AGAINST SURVIVOR OF SEXUAL VIOLENCE.

SO, JUST SPEAKING UP ABOUT MY OWN CASE, JUST QUESTION PEOPLE, WHY IS SHE TALKING ABOUT SUCH A SHAMEFUL THING, AND IT WAS JUST RIGHT BEFORE THE ME TOO MOVEMENT HAPPENED IN THE STATES HERE.

SO, IT WAS HARD TO LET PEOPLE KNOW WHY WE NEED TO HIGHLIGHT THESE CASES, AND WHY WE HAVE TO HEAR, LISTEN, THE SURVIVOR'S END OF THE STORY, BECAUSE, LIKE YOU SAID, ONLY 4 OR 5% GOES TO REPORT THE CASE, AND JUST TO REPORT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THE CASE WOULD BE TAKEN AFTERWARDS.

IT IS HARD.

WHEN I WENT TO POLICE, THEY TOLD ME, THESE THINGS HAPPENS A LOT, SO YOU SHOULD JUST FORGET ABOUT IT.

THAT IS HOW IT IS.

I ALSO HAVE TO REENACT, WITH LIFE-SIZED DOLL IN FOUR DIFFERENT POLICEMEN WERE TAKING PHOTO OF ME, REENACTING THE SEXUAL ASSAULT, AND WHEN WE THINK THIS CAN HAPPEN, IF YOU GO TO POLICE, OF COURSE, IT IS TOO MUCH.

YOU CAN'T GO ON AND TALK ABOUT YOUR CASE, BUT THAT IS WHY WE HAVE TO KNOW WHAT, AND WHICH TIME, WHICH LEVEL DO WE GET SILENCED IT IS NOT JUST BY SOCIETY, BUT IT IS A STRUCTURAL SYSTEM THAT SILENCING US.

>> IN FACT, YOU DESCRIBING HOW YOU WERE ASSAULTED WAS BRUTAL ENOUGH, BUT AGAIN, YOU SAYING THAT YOU HAVE TO REENACT IT, TRIGGERING IT ALL OVER AGAIN WITH THESE INVESTIGATORS.

YOU KNOW, DOES OCCUR TO ME THAT SOME PEOPLE WATCHING THIS DOCUMENT THREE IN JAPAN MIGHT ACTUALLY BE MORE INTIMIDATED BY COMING FORWARD, AS REDEEMING AS YOUR STORY MIGHT BE.

>> WELL, IT IS DIFFICULT ACTUALLY TO SCREEN THIS FILM IN JAPAN.

I THINK, AFTER THE ME TOO MOVEMENT, I THINK WE COVER MUCH MORE CASES ABOUT SEXUAL VIOLENCE, BUT WHEN THE CASE COMES WITH POWER CORRUPTION, IT IS STILL QUITE DIFFICULT TO COVER.

AGAIN, THIS IS NOT JUST JAPANESE STORY, IT IS VERY UNIVERSAL.

WE HAVE BEEN ABLE TO SCREEN OUR FILM OVER 57 COUNTRIES, BUT NOT YET IN JAPAN.

>> THAT SAYS SOMETHING IN AND OF ITSELF.

THE MENU ACCUSED, PETE YAMAGUCHI, A PROMINENT FIGURE.

AS WE SAID, HE BUILT THE LATE JAPANESE BIOGRAPHY -- YAMAGUCHI MAINTAINED HIS INNOCENCE TO THIS DAY.WE HAVE TO SAY, HE WAS NEVER CONVICTED OF A CRIME.

YOU KNOW, WHAT REALLY STRUCK ME IN THE PRESS CONFERENCE I JUST GAVE THAT YOU ATTENDED, HE SAID, QUOTE, I REALLY REGRET WHAT HAPPENED, BECAUSE SHE SUFFERED A LOT.

HOW DID YOU INTERPRET THAT COMMENT?

>> ACTUALLY -- WHILE HE WAS GIVING THE STATEMENT, AT THE PRESS CONFERENCE, I JOINED, AS WELL, TO LISTEN HIS SIDE OF THE STORY AS A JOURNALIST.

SO, I STILL REMEMBER THAT MOMENT, HEARING HIM SAYING, YOU KNOW, SORT OF SAME TO OTHERS, YES, I GOT PTSD, BUT HE ALSO SAYS, SO DID I SO, ME TOO.

AND THAT WAS REALLY A MAKEUP EYE FOR ME THAT, YOU KNOW, TALKING ABOUT TRUTH IS SO DIFFICULT, AND THERE ARE MULTIPLE SIDE OF THE STORY, BUT YET, THE REASON WHY IT'S SO HARD TO TALK ABOUT SEXUAL VIOLENCE IS BECAUSE, LEGALLY SPEAKING, IT'S HARD TO PROVE, AND THAT'S WHY I NAMED THIS FILM CALLED "BLACK BOX DIARIES," BECAUSE THESE POLICE AND PROSECUTORS ALWAYS SAYING, YOU KNOW, THESE SEXUAL VIOLENCE HAPPENS BEHIND THE CLOSED DOOR, AND IT IS IN BLACK BOXES.

NO ONE KNOWS WHAT HAPPENED.

THAT IS NOT TRUE.

THROUGH MY INVESTIGATION, I FOUND PEOPLE WHO REMEMBER RIGHT BEFORE ME GOING TO THE HOTEL, HOW I TRIED TO GET OFF FROM THE TAXI, HOW, YOU KNOW, I LOOKED WHEN HE WAS PULLING ME AWAY TO THE HOTEL ROOM.

SO, IT IS JUST THE MODEL OF HOW, LEGALLY, WE NEED TO UPDATE, ALL ALONG, THE DEFINITION OF -- IS STILL NOT THERE.

>> NOT CONSENT, IN MANY CASES, IT IS THE VIOLENCE THAT NEEDS TO BE PROVEN.

LOOK, YOU HAVE HAD SUPPORT, OF COURSE, BUT YOU HAVE ALSO FACED A LOT OF SHOCKING SLANDER AND BACKLASH AT HOME.

NATIONAL MEDIA BARELY COVERED THE STORY AT FIRST.

INVESTIGATORS KEPT GIVING YOU EXCUSES.

YOU HAVE TO POST THEM, BOTH INVESTIGATOR'S AND WITNESSES NOW, YOU ADDRESSED WHY YOU FELT YOU HAD TO DO THIS.

>> [ SPEAKING IN A NON-ENGLISH LANGUAGE ] [ SPEAKING IN A NON-ENGLISH LANGUAGE ] [ SPEAKING IN A NON-ENGLISH LANGUAGE ] ♪ >> LOOKING BACK, THE WAY YOU APPROACH THIS AS A JOURNALIST, DID IT HELP YOU, OR DO YOU THINK IT HELD YOU BACK?

WHAT KEPT YOU GOING?

AS YOU SAID, HAD TO DO SO MUCH OF THE LEGWORK YOURSELF.

>> YOU KNOW, I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS HAPPENED TO ME 2015, AND TODAY, 2025, IT HAS BEEN 10 YEARS THAT I HAVE BEEN FACING MY OWN CASE, AND I THINK, IN A WAY, BEING JOURNALIST HELPED ME, BECAUSE I COULD DISTANCE MYSELF AS A SURVIVOR, AND THAT WAS HOW I SURVIVED.

I THINK EVERY SURVIVOR HAS DIFFERENT WAY TO SURVIVE AND, FOR ME, WAS TO ASK QUESTION, SEEK JUSTICE.

SO, YOU KNOW, AFTER SPEAKING ABOUT MY CASE AND ASKING THESE QUESTIONS, I HAVE BEEN TOLD I'M VERY BRAVE, AND WE SHOULD ALL SPEAK UP, BUT NOT IN ALL SOCIETY, NOT IN EVERY CULTURE WOULD ACCEPT THAT.

YOU KNOW, THE FIRST THING YOU HAVE TO DO IS TO SURVIVE.

SO, IT IS NOT FOR EVERYONE, BUT FOR MY OWN CASE, I HAD TO DO IT, BECAUSE I HAD TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO ME, AND WHAT WAS THE POSSIBLE COVER UP, HOW DID THAT HAPPEN, AND TODAY, HAVEN'T GOT ANSWERS HOW THIS COVER-UP HAPPENED, AND WOULDN'T HAVE KNOWN WHY THIS STOPPED THE REASON.

SO, I AM KEEP ASKING THIS QUESTION THROUGH THIS FILM.

>> I DO WANT TO GET TO SOMETHING THAT WAS SO PAINFUL.

YOUR MOTHER WAS OUTSIDE THE COURTROOM THE DAY, YOU KNOW, THAT YOU TALKED ABOUT THIS RULING -- WAS A POSITIVE RULING FOR YOU -- BUT OF COURSE, THIS WAS SO DIFFICULT FOR YOUR FAMILY, AND YOU MADE THAT CLEAR, AS DID YOUR FAMILY.

HOW IS YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM NOW?

I HAVE TO CONFESS, SO MUCH OF WHAT I WATCHED IN THIS PROVOCATIVE DOCUMENT RE-, I WASHED IT AS A MOTHER, NOT AS A JOURNALIST.FORGIVE ME FOR THAT.

AS I WAS WATCHING IT, YOU KNOW, YOUR FAMILY WANTS YOUR HAPPILY EVER AFTER.

THAT IS WHAT THEY WANTED FOR YOU.

>> WAS EXTREMELY HARD FOR THEM, ESPECIALLY WITH THE JAPANESE SOCIETY BACKGROUND MINDSET, YOU KNOW, ASIAN FAMILY.

THEY WERE AFRAID OF WHAT KIND OF LIFE I WOULD GET IF I TALK ABOUT MY OWN EXPERIENCE OF SEXUAL VIOLENCE.

TODAY, IT IS STILL DIFFICULT, BECAUSE, THIS FILM HASN'T YET BEEN SCREENED IN JAPAN, BUT MY FAMILY ARE SUPPORTIVE OF THESE DAYS.

MY SISTER, ESPECIALLY, SHE IS MUCH YOUNGER THAN ME.

I WAS TRYING TO THINK ABOUT HER, ALWAYS, WHEN I SPEAK UP, BECAUSE I WISH THIS WOULD HAVE NEVER HAPPENED TO MY LITTLE SISTER.

BUT IT WAS DIFFICULT FOR THEM TO SEE MY NAME WITH THE -- YOU KNOW -- LABEL, VICTIM.

FOR THEM, I'M JUST SISTER, FOR THEM, I AM JUST.ORG.

BUT IT WAS INTERESTING WHEN " TIMES MAGAZINE" NAMED ME AS MOST INFLUENTIAL PEOPLE OF 100.

MY SISTER FINALLY CAN -- >> CLEARLY, A HIGHER PURPOSE TO YOUR WORK THERE.

SHIORI ITO, I REALLY WANT TO THANK YOU FOR WHAT OBVIOUSLY CONTINUES TO BE A DIFFICULT CONVERSATION FOR YOU BUT WE'LL CONTINUE FOLLOWING YOUR STORY.

YOU ARE SO APPRECIATED.

>> THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU.

>>> IF YOU OR SOMEONE YOU KNOW IS A VICTIM OF SEXUAL ASSAULT, THERE IS HELP.IF YOU ARE IN AMERICA, YOU CAN CALL 800-656- HOPE FOR THE NATURAL OF HIS NATIONAL SEXUAL ASSAULT HOTLINE, AVAILABLE 24/7.

>>> NEXT, SILICON VALLEY.

HAS BECOME TOO POWERFUL?

OUR NEXT GUEST BELIEVE SO.

IN AN EFFORT TO ADVOCATE FOR MORE RECOGNITION OF TECH COMPANIES, SHE PIVOTED FROM SERVING IN THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT TO STANFORD UNIVERSITY'S CYBER POLICY CENTER.

MARIETJE SCHAAKE JOINS HARI SREENIVASAN TO DISCUSS WHAT THE TECH TITANS GROUP ON WASHINGTON MEANS FOR DEMOCRACY.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US, MARIETJE SCHAAKE.

YOU HAVE A BOOK RECENTLY CALLED" THE TECH COOL: HOW TO SAVE DEMOCRACY FROM SILICON VALLEY."

I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE THINKING ABOUT THIS IF THEY SAW THE IMAGES FROM THE INAUGURATION, JUST BLINKING THE PRESIDENT ON ONE SIDE, SOME OF THE RICHEST HUMAN BEINGS ON THE PLANET ALL FROM THE TECH SECTOR.

WHEN YOU SAW THAT, WHAT CROSSED YOUR MIND?

>> I WAS ACTUALLY VERY DISAPPOINTED THAT THEY WOULD FUND AND SIT ON THE FRONT ROW WITH POLITICAL LEADERSHIP WALL POLICIES ARE SO MUCH RITUAL, AND WHILE THERE IS A LOT OF ILLEGITIMATE POWER NOW IN THE HANDS OF TECH CEOs LIKE ELON MUSK.

IT FEELS VERY OPPORTUNISTIC OF ALL THESE CEOs TO JUST JOIN THAT CROWD, HAVE NO REGARD, YOU KNOW, FOR SEPARATION OF POWERS FROM THE LAW, LACK OF CONFLICT OF INTEREST, YOU KNOW, WE ARE CLEARLY SEEING NOW AND WHAT HAS UNFOLDED SINCE THE INAUGURATION.

>> WHEN YOU CAME UP WITH THE TITLE FOR THE BOOK, PEOPLE PROBABLY ASKED YOU WHETHER THE WORD TO WAS OVER-THE-TOP.

DO YOU FEEL LIKE IT IS JUSTIFIED NOW?

>> I FELT LIKE IT WAS ALREADY JUSTIFIED, BECAUSE THE POWER GRAB BY TECH COMPANIES AND THE EXPENSE OF DEMOCRACY OFTEN HAS ITS LESS VISIBLE WAYS THAN WHAT WE ARE SEEING NOW, AND IN MANY WAYS, THE SYNERGY AS THE OVERLAP BETWEEN THE INTEREST OF THE TECH CEOs AND THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, IT WAS JUST THE NEXT PHASE OF THIS COUP, MAKES A MORE BLATANT, MORE CYNICAL, MORE RADICAL, BUT IT IS AN EXTENSION OF THE POWER GRAB THAT TECH COMPANIES HAVE BEEN DOING.

THIS ONE, IN VISIBLE WAYS, FOR A A WHILE NOW.

WHERE WE JUST SEE A LACK OF POWERS, INDEPENDENT OVERSIGHT, AND I FEAR THAT THE U.S. IS GOING EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION OF WHAT WE NEED AGAINST STRENGTHENING THE DEMOCRATIC GOVERNANCE, AND PROVIDING BALANCE AGAINST THIS OUTSIDE POWER FOR THE TECH SECTOR.

>> GIVE ME AN EXAMPLE OF HOW THIS IS A THREAT TO DEMOCRACY, BECAUSE WE ARE BOTH OLD ENOUGH TO RECOGNIZE WHEN, FOR EXAMPLE, THE ARAB SPRING NOT LONG AGO, AND OTHER DIFFERENT MOVEMENTS AROUND THE WORLD.

WE LOOKED AT THESE THINGS IN OUR HANDS AS THESE AMAZING TOOLS TO TRY TO INCREASE ACCESS TO DEMOCRACY ALL OVER THE GLOBE .

WE NOW HAVE THE ABILITY TO SHARE OUR OPINIONS.

LITERALLY, PEOPLE TOOK TO THE STREETS WITH IT.

SO, HOW DID THAT TURN?

YOU OUTLINED THIS IN THE BOOK.

>> YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

THERE IS A PROMISE OF THE INTERNET, WORLD WIDE WEB, MOBILE TECHNOLOGIES, SOCIAL MEDIA, WAS ALSO ONE OF DEMOCRATIZATION, THAT IT WOULD LIFT UP UNHEARD VOICES, ALLOW PEOPLE TO DOCUMENT AND SHARE HUMAN RIGHTS ABUSES.

BUT WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS THAT CORPORATE INTERESTS, PROFIT INTERESTS, SCALING INTERESTS, INVESTOR GOALS FOR SHAREHOLDERS, HAVE JUST PREVAILED, AND THEN, DEMOCRATIC GOVERNMENTS, IN THE MEANTIME, HAVE NEGLECTED, ADVOCATED THEIR RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE THAT GOVERNANCE DECISIONS WERE DESIGNED TO MAKE SURE THAT DEMOCRACY WOULD BE ACHIEVED THROUGH THE USE OF TECHNOLOGY.

TOO MUCH TRUST WAS PUT IN MARKET FORCES.

NOW, WE SEE THAT TECH COMPANIES KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT US, DEVELOPED PRODUCTS AND SERVICES THAT REALLY CHALLENGE THE RULE OF STATES WITH CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE, OR OFFENSIVE CYBER CAPABILITIES.

INTELLIGENCE CAPABILITIES THAT TECH COMPANIES NOW HAVE.

SO, THERE HAS JUST BEEN A THIS BALANCE THAT HAS EMERGED, WHEREAS THE COMPANIES ARE ACTUALLY POWERFUL.

THEY'RE NOT ACTING WITHIN A DEMOCRATIC MANDATE, WITHIN DEMOCRATIC OVERSIGHT.

IN MANY WAYS, THEY ARE OVERTAKING THE ROLE OF GOVERNANCE.

>> THIS SEEMS, AT LEAST IN AMERICA, TO HAVE HAPPENED UNDER THE WATCH OF MULTIPLE ADMINISTRATIONS, DEMOCRAT AND REPUBLICAN.

RIGHT?

WHAT DID WE NOT SEE COMING?

INITIALLY, IN TERMS OF REGULATION, TO ENCOURAGE INNOVATION WITH 1000 FLOWERS BLOOM, ET CETERA, AND AT WHAT POINT COULD WE HAVE, PERHAPS, DRAFTED A DIFFERENT PATH?

>> FOR A LONG TIME, I THINK THERE HAS BEEN OVER ROMANCE IS A SHIN OF WHAT SILICON VALLEY WAS, WHAT IT COULD MEAN.

THE NARRATIVE WAS VERY MUCH ABOUT DISRUPTING POWERFUL INCUMBENTS, YOU KNOW, ABOUT SMALL COMPANIES CHALLENGING THE BIG ACTORS, GUYS WITH THEIR LAPTOPS IN GARAGES, BUT THESE COMPANIES SCALED VERY QUICKLY.

THEY VERY QUICKLY BECAME THE INCUMBENTS, AND THEY ARE NOT ALWAYS SELLING A PRODUCT, BUT THEY ARE ALSO INTEGRATING EVERMORE DATA, EVER MORE FUNCTIONS, EVER MORE INSIGHTS AND DEPENDENCIES IN OUR LIVES, THE LIVES OF OUR GOVERNMENTS AND CITIZENS, IN OUR NATIONAL SECURITY, THEY PLAY A CRITICAL ROLE.

SO, I THINK THE ROMANTICIZED NARRATIVE HAS JUST BEEN BELIEVED FOR TOO LONG, AND THERE HAS NOT BEEN A RECOGNITION OF WHAT A POWER GRAB BY THESE COMPANIES COULD MEAN.

INDEED, IT HAS BEEN DEMOCRATIC AND REPUBLICAN LED GOVERNMENTS THAT HAVE JUST ALLOWED THESE COMPANIES TO GROW DISPROPORTIONATELY, AND WITHOUT THE SUFFICIENT GUARDRAILS THAT ARE NEEDED TO PROTECT PEOPLE.

>> IT IS INTERESTING, YOU ARE RIGHT.

THAT START UP IN THE GARAGE IS WHAT WE THINK ABOUT OF SILICON VALLEY, BUT WHEN YOU SORT OF SAW THAT CAST NEXT TO THE PRESIDENT, YOU SAW THE SCALE OF HOW HUGE THESE COMPANIES ARE.

IT SEEMS LIKE THERE IS MAYBE 1/2 DOZEN OR MORE SUPER PLAYERS THAT ARE INTEGRATED INTO WHAT WE LIKE TO CALL THE TECH STAFF.

>> EXACTLY.

THE DEPENDENCIES ARE ENORMOUS, THE WEALTH IS ENORMOUS, AND THE POTENTIAL FOR ABUSE OF POWER IS ENORMOUS.

LOOK AT WHAT ELON MUSK IS DOING THROUGH X NOW THROUGH HIS PERSONAL WEALTH, SUPPORTING FAR RIGHT PARTIES IN EUROPE.

HE IS A SICKLY GOING INTO THE U.S. GOVERNMENT WITHOUT A MANDATE, YOU KNOW, WITHOUT THE KIND OF ACCOUNTABILITY THAT BELONGS TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE THE KIND OF ACCESS THAT HE AND HIS SUPPORTERS OR HIS STAFF, WHATEVER THE PROPER TERM IS, NOW, HAVE, BY GOING INTO THE GOVERNMENT AGENCIES, INTO THE TECH INFRASTRUCTURE, AND TWEAKING THAT, ALL IN THE NAME OF EFFICIENCY.

BUT, OUTSIDE OF WHAT IS TYPICALLY A RULE OF LAW-BASED APPROACH TO GIVING PEOPLE POWER, BUT ALSO MAKING SURE THAT THEY ARE SUBJECT TO OVERSIGHT, FOR EXAMPLE, THAT THEY ARE APPROVED BY CONGRESS, WHICH IS NOT THE CASE.

SO, I THINK, IF THIS WOULD HAPPEN IN ANY OTHER COUNTRY THAN THE UNITED STATES, PEOPLE WOULD CLEARLY SEE THERE IS CONFIDENT OF INTEREST.

THIS IS BLURRING THE LINES, THIS DOES NOT FIT IN A DEMOCRATIC -- DEMOCRATICALLY- RUN STATE -- BUT NOW THAT IT IS HAPPENING IN THE UNITED STATES, I THINK PEOPLE ARE PARALYZED AND SHOCKED AT WHAT IS HAPPENING.

BUT THAT PARALYSIS CANNOT LAST TOO LONG.

THERE REALLY NEEDS TO BE ANGERING BACK IN THE U.S. CONSTITUTION TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS KIND OF ACCESS AND POTENTIAL ABUSE OF POWER, CONFLICT OF INTEREST, DOESN'T GO ON AS WE SEE IT HAPPENING TODAY.

>> THERE HAVE BEEN PERIODS IN AMERICA WHERE WE HAVE HAD, A DIFFERENT ERA OF WHAT WE ARE NOW CALLING OLIGARCHS -- BUT WE HAD THE ROBBER BARONS, THE GILDED AGE, THE VANDERBILT, RIGHT?

I WONDER, THAT WAS A TIME WHERE THEY EXERTED THEIR INFLUENCE OVER THE U.S. GOVERNMENT, THE TARIFF REGIMES, PRACTICES, AND SO FORTH.

I WONDER IF YOU CAN HELP OUR AUDIENCE UNDERSTAND THE CONFLICTS OF INTEREST THAT EXIST WITH, SAY, ELON MUSK, MARK ZUCKERBERG, JEFF BEZOS, THE KIND OF TIGHT AND THAT WE ARE SEEING HAVE GREATER ACCESS TO THE POWER OF THE WHITE HOUSE?

>> MANY OF THEM ACTUALLY SUPPLY THE GOVERNMENT OF THE UNITED STATES AND MANY GOVERNMENTS AROUND THE WORLD WITH CRITICAL SERVICES LIKE CLOUD COMPUTING, LIKE YOU MENTIONED, WITH SOFTWARE AND CYBERSECURITY PROTECTIONS.

SO, THERE IS A HUGE DEPENDENCY THERE, BUT IT ALSO MEANS THAT THESE COMPANIES KNOW A LOT ABOUT OUR SOCIETIES, BUT THE GOVERNMENT, AND NOW, APPARENTLY, ELON MUSK IS IN THE HEART OF THE U.S. GOVERNMENT, WITH ACCESS TO ALL KINDS OF SENSITIVE DATA.

AND SO, I THINK THAT DEPENDENCY, THROUGH CONTRACTS, THROUGH POTENTIAL, YOU KNOW, USE OF THE SENSITIVE INFORMATION THAT THESE COMPANIES HAVE ACCESS TO, CREATES A CONFLICT OF INTEREST.

THERE ARE REGULATORY BODIES THAT ELON MUSK IS NOW MAKING DECISIONS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, MAKING SO-CALLED EFFICIENCY STEPS.

ACTUALLY HAVE DIRECT OVERSIGHT OVER HIS COMPANIES.

THE SAME WITH MARK ZUCKERBERG, WHO IS NOW PUSHING DONALD TRUMP TO CONSIDER COMPETITION FINDS -- FINES AS A TRADE BARRIER -- AND THE KINDS OF WHISPERS OR ACTIONS ARE MUCH MORE DIRECT, YOU KNOW, USING THE U.S. GOVERNMENT AS A LEVER FOR INDIVIDUAL BUSINESS INTERESTS.

I THINK IT IS AS CLEAR AS IT GETS WHEN IT COMES TO CONFLICT OF INTEREST.

>> THE PRESIDENT HAS SAID, LAST WEEK, THERE IS NO CAUSE FOR CONCERN ABOUT THIS CONFERENCE OF INTEREST WITH ELON MUSK, IF THERE IS ONE, WE WON'T LET HIM GET NEAR IT.

WHAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH, PERHAPS, DONALD TRUMP'S UNDERSTANDING OF IT?

>> I MEAN, WE HAVE HEARD THE PRESIDENT SAY MANY THINGS THAT WERE NOT ACCURATE IN THE PAST.

YOU KNOW, JUST BECAUSE HE SAID THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT TRUE.

SO, I THINK THE PROBLEM WITH IT IS THAT ELON MUSK IS GAINING ACCESS TO HIGHLY SENSITIVE GOVERNMENT DATA, AND SYSTEMS, MAKING CONSEQUENTIAL DECISIONS ABOUT JOBS, ABOUT BUDGETS, ABOUT OPERATIONS, WITHOUT A MANDATE THAT IS TYPICALLY GIVEN TO PEOPLE WITH SUCH ACCESS TO THESE SYSTEMS, AND, ON TOP OF THE FACT THAT HE IS BASICALLY OPERATING WITH A PARALLEL POWER STRUCTURE -- DOESN'T HAVE TO RESEND AUTHORITY OVER HIS COMPANIES, FOR EXAMPLE, IS NOT SUBJECT TO THE SAME ETHICS OR ACCOUNTABILITY RULED THAT AN OFFICIAL GOVERNMENT APPOINTEE WOULD BE THROUGH OVERSIGHT OF CONGRESS, FOR EXAMPLE, BUT IT IS ALSO JUST VERY RADICAL STEPS WITH REAL CONSEQUENCES FOR PEOPLE AROUND THE WORLD.

>> LOOK, THERE IS GOING TO BE PEOPLE THAT LISTEN TO THE CONVERSATION AND SAY, LOOK, WE SEE THOSE DOING EXACTLY WHAT THEY SHOULD BE DOING TO TRY TO PROTECT THEIR INTERESTS, THEIR POLITICAL AND SHAREHOLDER INTERESTS.

REPORTING FROM A RECENT COLUMN, "NEW YORK TIMES," JULIA POINT SOUTH, FOR EXAMPLE, IN THE EUROPEAN UNION, GOOGLE HAS BEEN FIND $8 6 BILLION THE LAST TICKET, APPLE IS LIABLE FOR 13 1/2 BILLION DOLLARS IN TEXTILES AND IRELAND AFTER LOSING A COURT CASE.

META WAS FINED 830 MILLION BY THE EUROPEAN COMMISSION, WITH A LEVEL OF MILLIONS AGAINST X.

DOESN'T IT MAKE SENSE FOR THESE INDIVIDUALS TO COZY UP TO WHOEVER IS IN POWER AND SAY, HEY, CAN WE, AS THE UNITED STATES, ASSERT SOME LEVERAGE ON HIS OLD ALLIES OF OURS TO MAKE SURE WE ARE NOT OVERLY REGULATED IN THESE MARKETS?

>> THE FINES YOU MENTION ARE A LOT FOR PEOPLE LIKE YOU AND I, BUT NOT A LOT FOR THESE BILLION- DOLLAR COMPANIES.

EVEN THOUGH THESE ARE IMPRESSIVE FINE S, THEY ARE JUST PART OF THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS FOR MOST, AND WE HAVE TO ASK OURSELVES WHETHER THAT IS EFFICIENT.

HAVING TRUST, HAVING RULES ABOUT FAIRNESS IN THE ECONOMY, BASED ON CENTURY-OLD LAWS THAT ALSO EXIST IN THE UNITED STATES.THIS IS NOT SIMPLY EUROPEAN PHENOMENON THAT GOES AFTER U.S. COMPANIES, EU-BASED COMPANIES MAY ALSO BE SUBJECT TO COMPETITION AND ANTITRUST CASES AND FINES.

THEY COULD APPEAL, AND ULTIMATELY, THERE IS A VERDICT WITH A POSSIBLE SANCTIONS.AND SO, I THINK, YOU KNOW, IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT THE FTC HAS BEEN DOING UNDER THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION, THE IDEA THAT TOO MUCH POWER CONCENTRATION DOESN'T ONLY HURT THE ECONOMY AND THEY GET STIFLED -- BUT ALSO IMPACTS DEMOCRACY, HAS IMPACT ON THE RIGHT TO PRIVACY, FOR EXAMPLE, WITH SOMETHING THAT WE SHARE ACROSS THE ATLANTIC.

IT IS JUST WITH THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION THAT THESE TECH CEOs LIKE ELON MUSK, FOR EXAMPLE, SAY, COMPETITION SANCTIONS SHOULD ACTUALLY BE CONSIDERED A TARIFF.

THEY SHOULD BE CONSIDERED PART OF THE TRADE WAR THAT IS NOW EXPECTED TO BE UNLEASHED BY DONALD TRUMP WITH ALL THE NEGATIVE CONSEQUENCES THAT THAT IS GOING TO HAVE.

SO, THE TECH CEOs ARE VERY OPPORTUNISTIC, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THERE ARE WAYS TO JUSTIFY IT IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM.

>> YOU ARE A NUMBER OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT.

CAN YOU LAY OUT HOW DIFFERENT THIS PATH HAS BEEN ALTERED MAYBE AND WHAT THE STEPS WE SHOULD TAKE OUR?

>> I THINK IT IS CRUCIAL TO GET MORE TRANSPARENCY INTO HOW THE INNER WORKINGS OF TECH COMPANIES IMPACT OUR SOCIETY.

THINK ABOUT RAMIFICATIONS WHEN IT COMES TO SOCIAL MEDIA, THINK ABOUT THE PUBLIC INTEREST IN UNDERSTANDING A.I.

MODELS, YOU KNOW, WHICH IS NOW OFTEN SHIELDED BY A.I.

COMPANIES AS A TRADE SECRET, BUT WE REALLY NEED TO HAVE, FOR EXAMPLE, RESEARCH A.I.

MODELS MUCH MORE DEEPLY.

AS ACADEMICS, FOR EXAMPLE, BUT ALSO, I THINK IT IS KEY THAT GOVERNMENTS, WHEN THEY USE TECHNOLOGY TO PERFORM, YOU KNOW, TAX SERVICES, OR INVESTIGATIONS, AT LEAST, THAT THEY HAVE THE SAME KIND OF TRANSPARENCY AND ACCOUNTABILITY THAT THEY WOULD HAVE IF THEY WOULD NOT HAVE OUTSOURCED THESE TASKS TO COMPANIES, BUT WE OFTEN SEE IS THERE IS A DIFFERENT TREATMENT, LET'S SAY, WITH PRACTICES ON THE PART OF POLICE WHEN THEY ARE DONE DIRECTLY, BUT AT LEAST, WHEN THEY ARE OUTSOURCED TO TECH COMPANIES.

SO, HAVING THAT KIND OF PUBLIC ACCOUNTABILITY IS CRITICAL, BUT ALSO, TO BRING IN INDEPENDENT EXPERTISE IN LEGISLATIVE BODIES SO THAT LOBBYISTS SPENDING, YOU KNOW, HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO INFLUENCE OUR LAWMAKERS ARE NOT AS SUCCESSFUL, SO THAT LAWMAKERS HAVE ACCESS TO INDEPENDENT EXPERTISE ON TECHNOLOGY WHEN THEY NEED IT MOST.

>> YOU WERE ON STAGE WITH ERIC SCHMIDT, FORMER CEO OF GOOGLE IN 2019.

SOMETHING YOU SAID.

>> VERY CLEAR TECH COMPANIES CANNOT STAY ON THE FENCE IN TAKING A POSITION IN RELATION TO VALUES AND RIGHTS.

I PERSONALLY BELIEVE THAT A RULES- BASED ORDER SERVE THE PUBLIC INTEREST, AS WELL AS INDIVIDUALLY COLLECTIVE RIGHTS AND LIBERTIES THAT COMPANIES BENEFIT FROM, BUT THEN, EVERYBODY HAS THEIR ROLE TO PLAY TO ALSO CONTRIBUTE TO THE COMMON INTEREST AND STRENGTHEN THE RESILIENCE OF OUR ECONOMY.

>> THAT WAS 2019.

WE ARE NOT CLOSER OR FURTHER AWAY FROM WHAT YOU WERE INTERESTED IN?

>> MUCH FURTHER AWAY, UNFORTUNATELY.

WE RECENTLY LOST THE UNITED STATES FOR THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE WHEN IT COMES TO LEGISLATION.

WE HAVE LOST THE COMPANIES WHEN IT COMES TO ARTICULATING VALUES LIKE HUMAN RIGHTS AND DEMOCRATIC RIGHTS, FOR EXAMPLE.

SO, I REALLY THINK THIS IS A TIME FOR THOSE WHO DON'T WANT TO BE REPRESENTED BY ELON MUSK.

AND CEOs IN THE FRONT TO SPEAK OUT.

I THINK IT IS A TIME TO REALLY RECALIBRATE AROUND INSTITUTIONAL PRINCIPLES.

IT REALLY IS AROUND THOSE VERY, VERY BASICS IN THE UNITED STATES, NOW THAT THE DEFENSES HAVE TO BE ORGANIZED, AND IT ALSO MEANS THAT THE RIGHT REGULATION OF TECHNOLOGY FROM A DEMOCRATIC POINT OF VIEW IS HAPPENING IN EUROPE.

THAT IS REALLY THE ONLY CASE WHERE A SIGNIFICANT MARKET IS PUTTING DEMOCRATIC GUARDRAILS AROUND HOW A.I.

AND OTHER TECHNOLOGY CAN BE USED IN OUR SOCIETY.

SO, THAT IS ALSO GOING TO BE A SPACE TO WATCH, IN TERMS OF HOW SAFE THESE STANDARDS ARE BEING DEVELOPED, HOW COMPANIES CAN MITIGATE THE RISKS THAT THEIR MODELS MAY PRESENT, BOTH IN THE SHORT TERM AND IN THE LONG- TERM.

I THINK THAT IT WILL ALSO BE CRITICAL FOR TRUST IN A.I.

AND TECHNOLOGY ITSELF.

I MEAN, THAT REALLY CUTS BOTH WAYS.

YOU CAN'T JUST LOOK AT REGULATION AS A BURDEN.

IT ALSO HELPED DEVELOP TRUST AND LEVEL THE PLAYING FIELD, SO, FAIR TREATMENTS FOR ALL COMPANIES.

I THINK THAT IS VERY, VERY IMPORTANT.

EVEN MORE SO THAN IT WAS IN 2019.

>> THE BOOK IS CALLED "THE TECH TO: HOW TO SAVE DEMOCRACY FROM SILICON VALLEY."

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US, MARIETJE SCHAAKE.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>>> FINALLY, A PAIR OF FIGURE SKATERS TAKEN TO THE ICE WITH A MESSAGE FOR THE WORLD.

THESE OLYMPIC CHAMPIONS, MADISON HUBBELL FROM THE U.S., GABRIELLA PAPADAKIS FROM FRANCE, WITH HEADLINES WITH A SUBLIME SKATING, BUT THE FACT THAT THEY DANCED TOGETHER.MANY COUNTRIES DO NOT ALLOW SAME-SEX COUPLES TO COMPETE CANADA'S SPORTS GOVERNING BODY ALLOWED IT JUST TWO YEARS AGO.

WITH THIS PERFORMANCE, THESE SKATERS HOPED TO USE THEIR FAME TO BREAK DOWN GENDER BARRIERS AND ENCOURAGE CHANGE.

>>> THAT IS IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.

WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT IS COMING UP ON THE SHOW EACH NIGHT, SIGN UP FOR OUR NEWSLETTER AT PBS.ORG/AMANPOUR.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY."

JOIN US AGAIN TOMORROW NIGHT.