>>> NOW, A FEDERAL JUDGE IN MARYLAND IS BLOCKING THE TRUMP/MUSK DISMANTLING OF USAID, AS WE MENTIONED.

AUTHOR JOHN GREEN ARGUES THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION'S CUTS TO FOREIGN AID ARE MAKING GLOBAL HEALTH OUTCOMES WORSE, ESPECIALLY FOR INFECTIOUS DISEASES LIKE TUBERCULOSIS.

GREEN EXPLAINS WHY TB IS STILL SO PREVALENT IN HIS NEW BOOK, AND HE JOINS HARI TO TALK ABOUT IT.

>> CHRISTIANE, THANK YOU.

JOHN GREEN, THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

MOST OF THE FOLKS WATCHING THIS MIGHT REMEMBER YOU FROM THE BOOKS THAT YOU'VE WRITTEN, THE YOUNG ADULT CLASSICS THAT HAVE BEEN TURNED INTO MOVIES AND SO FORTH.

YOU HAVE A NEW BOOK OUT, AND IT IS "EVERYTHING IS TUBERCULOSIS. "

THIS IS NONFICTION.

WHY -- I KNOW YOU'VE WRITTEN NONFICTION BEFORE, BUT WHY TUBERCULOSIS?

WHAT MADE YOU WANT TO GO AFTER THIS TOPIC?

>> YEAH, THIS IS CERTAINLY A BIT OF A DEPARTURE FOR ME, BUT IN OTHER WAYS, I'M STILL WRITING ABOUT YOUNG PEOPLE WHO ARE INTERESTED IN POETRY, WHICH HAS ALWAYS BEEN MY JAM.

I WANTED TO WRITE ABOUT THIS BECAUSE I MET A KID LIVING WITH TUBERCULOSIS, AND AFTER THAT, THE DISEASE BECAME UNDENIABLE TO ME, AND I CAME HOME OBSESSED WITH IT.

I WANTED TO UNDERSTAND HOW IT WAS THAT I HAD NO IDEA THAT TB WAS STILL THE DEADLIEST INFECTIOUS DISEASE IN THE WORLD, AND WHY WE'RE LETTING A CURABLE DISEASE KILL OVER A MILLION PEOPLE EVERY YEAR.

>> YOU KNOW, THE FACT THAT IT'S CURABLE IS STARTLING.

WHAT DOES WORK?

BECAUSE WE HAVE TRIED, AS YOU POINT OUT, GOING BACK IN HISTORY, WE'VE TRIED EVERYTHING FROM, YOU KNOW, BLOOD- LETTING TO ANIMAL SACRIFICE, AND EVERYTHING ELSE THAT WE THOUGHT THAT WAS CAUSING THIS.

IT'S BEEN AROUND FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS AND DOCUMENTED.

>> YEAH, I MEAN, THEY WERE TOLD NOT TO TREAT CONSUMPTION, BECAUSE IT WOULD MAKE THEM LOOK LIKE BAD HEALERS.

TODAY, WE HAVE POWERFUL ANTIBIOTICS.

IT'S NOT EASY TO CURE TUBERCULOSIS, IT TAKES BETWEEN FOUR AND SIX MONTHS OF ANTIBIOTIC THERAPY TO CURE IT.

BUT YOU CAN CURE IT, OFTEN WITH DRUGS THAT HAVE BEEN AROUND SINCE THE 1950s AND '60s.

>> MAYBE A SIMPLE SCIENCE QUESTION HERE, HOW IS TUBERCULOSIS TRANSMITTED?

WHAT DOES IT DO TO THE BODY?

>> IT'S AN AIRBORNE DISEASE, SO, IT SPREADS THROUGH THE AIR, AND THE AVERAGE PERSON WHO IS UNTREATED WITH TUBERCULOSIS AND HAS ACTIVE TB WILL SPREAD IT TO 10 AND 15 PEOPLE A YEAR.

IT USUALLY SETTLES IN THE LUNGS, AND THAT'S WHERE IT'S TRANSMITTED FROM, OBVIOUSLY, BECAUSE OF COUGHING AND SNEEZING AND THE LIKE.

BUT IT CAN ALSO ATTACK ANY SYSTEM IN THE BODY, THERE'S MENINGITIS, WHICH PROBABLY KILLED EDGAR ALLEN POE, WHEN IT ATTACKS YOUR BRAIN.

TUBERCULOSIS THAT ATTACKS YOUR LYMPH NODES.

MY FRIEND HENLY RY HAD LYMPH NOELDS ERUPT FROM HIS SKIN WITH TUBERCULOSIS.

IT CAN ATTACK ANYWHERE.

>> WHAT IS IT THAT YOU FIND WEIRD ABOUT THIS DISEASE?

YOU CALL IT THAT.

WHAT MAKES THIS SO TOUGH TO FIGHT?

>> THIS IS A HARD DISEASE TO FIGHT FOR A NUMBER OF REASONS, BUT THE BIGGEST REASON IS A LACK OF POLITICAL WILL AND A LACK OF RESOURCES.

IT'S TRUE THAT TUBERCULOSIS IS HARD TO CURE, BUT MY BROTHER HAD CANCER A COUPLE YEARS AGO, AND AT NO POINT DID ANYONE SAY, OH, SORRY, HANK, THIS IS A TOUGH DISEASE TO CURE, THIS IS GOING TO TO REQUIRE MONTHS OF RADIATION AND CHEMOTHERAPY, BUT WE DON'T THINK IT'S WORTH THE COST.

THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE IN IMPOVERISHED COMMUNITIES HEAR ALL THE TIME.

>> WE HAVE THE MEDICINES, BUT THERE'S A GAP BETWEEN WHERE THE DISEASE IS AND THE MEDICINES ARE.

>> IT BOILS DOWN TO POLITICS AND A WILL TO GET THE CURE TO THE PEOPLE WHO NEED IT, YES.

I THINK IT ALSO BOILS DOWN -- I ARGUE IN THE BOOK THAT TUBERCULOSIS IS EVERYTHING, AND EVERYTHING IS TUBERCULOSIS.

YES, IT'S POLITICS, BUT IT IS ALSO HISTORY, COLONIALISM, IT'S STRATEGIES OF EXTRACTIVE CAPITALISM THAT JUST DON'T WORK FOR IMPROVE IRISHED COMMUNITIES.

>> YOU SAY IT HAS LONG --TUBE BECK LORE SIS HAS LONG WRIGGLED ITS WAY THROUGH THE PATHS INJUSTICE CREATES.

GIVE ME AN EXAMPLE.

>> WELL, I'LL GIVE YOU A GREAT EXAMPLE.

IF YOU OR I WERE TO GET TUBERCULOSIS TOMORROW, WE WOULD RECEIVE THE KIND OF PERSONALIZED, TAILORED TREATMENT THAT EVERYBODY SHOULD DESERVE.

BUT MY FRIEND HENRY, WHEN HE GOT SICK WITH TUBERCULOSIS, HE WAS TOLD THAT THOSE TREATMENTS WERE NOT AVAILABLE TO HIM, BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T COST EFFECTIVE.

SO, INSTEAD, HE WAS PUT ON A SECONDARY ANTIBIOTIC THAT THEY SHOULD HAVE KNOWN FROM THE BEGINNING WOULDN'T WORK, BUT THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE MONEY FOR GOOD TESTS, EITHER.

AND SO, HE ENDED UP HOSPITALIZED FOR OVER THREE YEARS, TAKING OVER 20,000 PILLS TO BE CURED.

AND MANY OF THOSE PILLS AND MANY OF THOSE MONTHS WERE SIMPLY UNNECESSARY.

>> WHY DID HENRY AFFECT YOU SO MUCH?

>> WELL, HE HAS THE SAME NAME AS MY SON, AND WHEN I FIRST MET HIM, HE LIKED OOKED TO BE THE SAME AGE AS MY SON, WHO WAS 9 AT THE TIME, BUT IT TURNED OUT HE WAS 17.

HE'S ONE OF THOSE UNCOMMONLY CHARISMATIC PEOPLE.

I'M NOT THE ONLY PERSON WHO IS UNUSUALLY CHARMED BY HENRY.

HE WAS SORT OF THE MAYOR OF THE TUBERCULOSIS HOSPITAL IN SE IERRA LEONE.

HE'S BELOVED BY THE STAFF AT THAT HOSPITAL.

SO, HE JUST --SOMETIMES PEOPLE COME INTO YOUR LIFE, YOU DON'T TOTALLY UNDERSTAND WHY, AND YOU END UP SPENDING THE NEXT FOUR YEARS OBSESSED WITH AN INFECTIOUS DISEASE AND WRITING A BOOK ABOUT IT.

>> YEAH, YEAH.

YOU ALSO WROTE ABOUT AN INTERESTING CHARACTER, A 19-YEAR-OLD TB PATIENT IN INDIA.

AND YOU HAVE ACTUALLY CALLED HER NAME OUT, SORT OF IN TESTIMONY BEFORE, SHE DIED IN 2018.

YOU SAID SHE DIDN'T REALLY DIE OF TUBERCULOSIS.

WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?

>> WELL, I THINK IN THE 21st CENTURY, IT'S SAFE TO SAY THAT TUBERCULOSIS ISN'T REALLY CAUSED BY A BACTERIA ANYMORE, BECAUSE WE KNOW HOW TO KILL THAT BACTERIA.

WE KNOW HOW TO CURE TUBERCULOSIS.

IN THE 21st CENTURY, WE HAVE TO ACCEPT THE REALITY THAT TUBERCULOSIS IS CAUSED BY US.

THE ULTIMATE CAUSE OF HER DEATH, YES, IT WAS TUBERCULOSIS, BUT IT WAS OFFICIAL INDIFFERENCE, IT WAS A FAILURE TO GET THIS LIFE-SAVING DRUG TO HER IN TIME.

ALL OF THESE THINGS CAME TOGETHER TO RESULT IN HER DEATH.

AND SO, I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR TO SAY SHE DIED ONLY OF TUBERCULOSIS.

I THINK SHE ALSO DIED OF HUMAN-BUILT SYSTEMS THAT SIMPLY DIDN'T INCLUDE PEOPLE LIKE HER.

>> HUH.

AND IN THIS RESEARCH, YOU FOUND KIND OF HISTORICAL CONNECTIONS TO YOUR OWN FAMILY.

WHAT HAPPENED?

>> YEAH, MY GREAT UNCLE STOKES GOODRICH DIED OF TUBERCULOSIS.

WHEN I TOLD MY MOM I WAS WRITING ABOUT TUBERCULOSIS, SHE SAID, THAT'S WHAT YOUR GREAT UNCLE DIED OF.

I UNEARTHED A MEMOIR THAT TELLS HIS STORY.

HE WAS A LINEWORKER AND ENDED UP DYING, LIKE SO MANY PEOPLE, IN A SAN OR THE YUM, IN 1930.

>> YOU KIND OF POINT OUT THAT, YOU KNOW, AS THE --AS THE TITLE SAYS, THE DIFFERENT WAYS THAT TUBERCULOSIS HAS IMPACTED SOCIETY.

ON THE ONE HAND, IT MIGHT HAVE LED TO THE BEGINNING OF WORLD WAR I, ON THE OTHER HAND, IT MIGHT ACTUALLY BE THE REASON THAT TOWNS IN CALIFORNIA SPRUNG UP.

GIVE US THE SCOPE OF THESE PLACES THAT WE DON'T SEE TUBERCULOSIS IN THE HISTORY BOOKS, BUT IT CLEARLY PLAYED A ROLE.

>> YEAH, FROM PASADENA, CALIFORNIA, TO COLORADO SPRINGS, COLORADO, THERE ARE SO MANY CITIES IN THE AMERICAN WEST THAT WERE ESSENTIALLY FOUNDED AS TUBERCULOSIS COLONIES, BECAUSE AT THE TIME, IN THE 19th AND EARLY 20th CENTURY, IT WAS BELIEVED THAT HEADING WEST TOWARD DRIER AIR COULD SORT OF DRY OUT THE WET LUNGS OF TUBERCULOSIS.

CALIFORNIA CALLED ITSELF THE LAND OF NEW LUNGS.

AND THE MOVEMENT OF PEOPLE THERE RIVALED THE GOLD RUSH.

IT WAS A REALLY SIGNIFICANT SHIFT IN OUR HUMAN GEOGRAPHY HERE IN THE UNITED STATES.

I ALSO ARGUE THAT TB WAS A CAUSE OF WORLD WAR I. I SHOULD SAY, LIKE, NOT THE PRIMARY CAUSE, BUT BOTH OF THE YOUNG MEN WHO ACTIVELY PARTICIPATED IN THE ASSASSINATION OF ARCH DUKE FRANCE FERDINAND WAS DYING OF TUBERCULOSIS AND KNEW THEY WERE DYING.

AS A RESULT, THEY WANTED TO DIE FOR A GREAT CAUSE.

>> YOU POINTED OUT THAT TWO OF THE THREE CONSPIRATORS WHO DIDN'T HAVE THAT DEATH ESSENTIAL TES, THEY CHICKENED OUT.

>> YEAH, THEY BAILED ON THE DAY.

THEY DECIDED THAT MAYBE IT WASN'T A GOOD IDEA TO ASSASSINATION THE ARCH DUKE, WHICH, OBVIOUSLY GIVEN WHAT HAPPENED, IT WASN'T.

>> YOU HAVE BEEN ONLINE IN THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS, REALLY ACTIVE ABOUT THINKING ABOUT TUBERCULOSIS AND ADVOCATING ON ITS BEHALF, AND YOU'VE BEEN VERY POINTED IN YOUR CRITIQUE OF HOW THE PHARMACEUTICAL INDUSTRY WORKS, AND WHY THIS DRUG THAT WE'VE KNOWN ABOUT, THAT THIS CURE THAT WE'VE HAD FOR SO LONG, IS STILL NOT ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE LIKE HENRY.

>> IT IS VERY FRUSTRATING FOR ME THAT WE HAVE THE TOOLS TO DEAL WITH THIS DISEASE, IT'S NOT ONLY A PROBLEM OF PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES, IT'S ALSO A PROBLEM OF GOVERNMENTS, IT'S ALSO A PROBLEM OF, YOU KNOW, OUR NONPROFITS BEING AS EFFICIENT AS THEY CAN BE, BUT IT'S MOSTLY A PROBLEM OF GOVERNMENTS AND DEVELOPING THE TOOLS AND MAKING THOSE TOOLS AVAILABLE.

TOO OFTEN, WE DEVELOP TOOLS BUT DON'T MAKE THEM AVAILABLE IN THE PLACES WHERE THEY'RE MOST NEEDED.

IN 2000, A DOCTOR FAMOUSLY SAID OF HIV, WHERE ARE THE DRUGS?

THE DRUGS ARE WHERE THE DISEASE IS NOT, AND WHERE IS THE DISEASE?

THE DISEASE IS WHERE THE DRUGS ARE NOT.

AND THAT'S VERY MUCH THE CASE FOR TUBERCULOSIS.

THE CURE IS WHERE THE DISEASE IS NOT.

AND THAT'S INFURIATING TO ME.

IF WE REALLY VALUE ALL HUMAN LIVES EQUALLY, WE SIMPLY HAVE TO DO A BETTER JOB OF GETTING THESE CURES TO THE PEOPLE WHO NEED THEM.

>> I'M ASSUMING FOR SOMEONE LIKE YOU, YOU LOVE THE UNKNOWN FACT THAT KIND OF MAKES YOU THINK ABOUT SOMETHING DIFFERENTLY OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

BUT WHAT WERE SOME OF THE THINGS THAT YOU KIND OF STUMBLED UPON IN THIS THAT YOU ENDED UP INCLUDING IN THE BOOK, BUT ALSO, THAT JUST KIND OF CHANGED YOUR FRAME OF REFERENCE ON HOW YOU THOUGHT ABOUT EITHER THE DISEASE OR THE INJUSTICES OF THE WORLD?

>> THERE ARE SO MANY THINGS I'VE LEARNED IN THIS JOURNEY THAT HAVE HELPED ME UNDERSTAND AND CONTEXTUALIZE THE WAY THAT INJUSTICE WORKS IN OUR WORLD, AND THE WAY THAT HEALTH AND EQUITY BECOMES A FORM AND EXPRESSION OF INJUSTICE.

I THINK THE MOST SHOCKING STATISTIC TO ME IS THAT SINCE TUBERCULOSIS BECAME CURABLE, WE'VE ALLOWED AT LEAST 150 MILLION PEOPLE TO DIE OF IT.

WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT US?

WHAT DOES THAT SAY ABOUT THE WORLD WE SHARE?

AND WHAT -- HOW DOES IT POINT TO A WORLD WE MIGHT SHARE THAT MIGHT BE BETTER FOR THOSE PEOPLE?

>> WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT, IN THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS, WE'VE SEEN AN ENORMOUS RETREAT FROM THE U. S. GOVERNMENT IN TERMS OF TUBERCULOSIS TREATMENT THAT WE HELP FUND WORLDWIDE.

WHAT DO YOU THINK THE CONSEQUENCES ARE GOING TO BE OF THESE ACTIONS?

>> THE CONSEQUENCES ARE ALREADY PROFOUND, AND THEY WILL BECOME EVEN MORE PROFOUND OVER TIME, UNFORTUNATELY.

THE UNITED STATES HAS LONG BEEN THE MOST GENEROUS SUPPORTER OF THE FIGHT AGAINST TUBERCULOSIS, AND A KEY ALLY IN EVERY COUNTRY THAT'S FIGHTING THE DISEASE.

IN A COUNTRY LIKE SIERRA LEONE, YOU KNOW, THE --WITHOUT USAID MONEY, THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE ARE LOSING ACCESS TO THEIR TREATMENT.

HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE ARE SEEING THEIR TREATMENT INTERRUPTED, WHICH MEANS SKYROCKETING RISKS OF INCREASED DRUG RESISTANCE.

WE KNOW THAT HAVING DRUG RESISTANT TUBERCULOSIS CIRCULATING IN COMMUNITIES IS VERY BAD NEWS.

IT'S BAD NEWS FOR INDIVIDUALS, BUT IT IS ALSO VERY DANGEROUS FOR SOCIAL WORKERS AS A WHOLE, BECAUSE WE COULD GET A FORM OF TUBERCULOSIS THAT NO LONGER RESPONDS TO THE TOOLS THAT WE'VE DEVELOPED TO FIGHT IT.

THAT'S SCARY.

IT SHOULD SCARE US.

AND IT IS DEVASTATING TO WATCH THIS UNFOLD.

I MEAN -- I NEVER IMAGINED I WOULD BE PUBLISHING THIS BOOK AT A TIME WHERE IT'S SO TIMELY.

I NEVER --I NEVER THOUGHT THE WORLD WOULD BE TALKING ABOUT TUBERCULOSIS, BUT IT IS, BECAUSE UNFORTUNATELY, THE MACHINERY THAT WE USE TO GET TB TREATMENT TO PEOPLE HAS JUST GROUND TO A HALT AS A RESULT OF THESE SPENDING CUTS.

>> SO, I KNOW THAT THERE ARE DRUG RESISTANT VERSIONS OF TB IN DIFFERENT POCKETS OF THE WORLD, I KNOW IN IRAN, INDIA, THERE ARE PLACES --I WONDER, DO WE HAVE, LIKE, IF WE START TO STRIP AWAY SOME OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE THAT CAN EVEN TRACK AND TRACE WHERE EXPLOSIONS OF TUBERCULOSIS MIGHT BE HAPPENING, THEN THERE SEEMS TO BE AN INCREASED LIKELIHOOD, THEN, THAT THERE MIGHT BE MORE DRUG RESISTANT STRAINS THAT MAKE THEIR WAY THROUGH COMMUNITIES, BECAUSE WE'RE NOT REALLY WATCHING THEM AND WE INTERRUPTED THE COURSES OF TREATMENT THAT MIGHT STOP THEM.

>> THAT'S A GREAT POINT, AND A REALLY IMPORTANT ONE.

IT'S NOT JUST THAT WE'VE STOPPED TREATING PEOPLE WITH TUBERCULOSIS, WE HAVE ALSO STOPPED COUNTING HOW MANY PEOPLE AREN'T BEING TREATED WITH TUBERCULOSIS.

AND SO THERE WILL BE AN UNFOLD AMOUNT OF SUFFERING THAT RESULTS FROM THIS DECISION, BUT IN SOME CASES, WE WON'T UNDERSTAND THE FULL SCOPE OF THAT DEVASTATION FOR DECADES, BECAUSE WE'VE SIMPLY STOPPED COUNTING.

>> IT WAS ALSO INTERESTING TO ME READING THE BOOK WAS JUST THE KIND OF BIOLOGY OF HOW IT WORKS, WHICH I DIDN'T FRANKLY REALLY KNOW.

WHAT YOU POINT OUT IS REALLY HOW THIS THING DEVELOPS IN OUR BODY, AND HOW MANY HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE HAVE IT, AND THEY JUST --IT'S JUST LATENT.

AND IT'S KIND OF -- OUR BODY KEEPS IT AT BAY.

BUT FOR SOME PEOPLE, THAT'S NOT THE CASE.

>> YEAH, THAT'S EXACTLY RIGHT.

TUBERCULOSIS DIVIDES INCREDIBLY SLOWLY FOR A BACTERIA.

HUNDREDS OF TIMES SLOWER THAN SOMETHING LIKE E. COLI, BECAUSE IT HAS THIS THICK, FATTY CELL WALL THAT MAKES IT REALLY HARD TO PENETRATE.

SO, IT'S BOTH VERY SLOW- MOVING AND HARD TO KILL.

THE BODIES DEAL WITH THAT IS SURROUND THE BACTERIA WITH WHITE CELLS.

AND THOSE CAN HOLD THE INFECTION IN CHECK FOR A LIFETIME.

USUALLY, IN FACT.

SOMETHING LIKE 25% OF PEOPLE IN THE WORLD RIGHT NOW HAVE EXPERIENCED A TUBERCULOSIS INFECTION, BUT THE VAST MAJORITY OF THEM WILL NEVER GET SICK.

WE DON'T FULLY UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE DO BECOME SICK, BUT WE KNOW THERE ARE IMPORTANT RISK FACTORS THAT INCLUDE MALNUTRITION, HIV INFECTION, OTHER HEALTH CONDITIONS LIKE DIABETES, SO, ALL THOSE ARE RISK FACTORS FOR DEVELOPING ACTIVE DISEASE, BUT A LOT OF TIMES PEOPLE DEVELOP ACTIVE DISEASE AND WE STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY.

>> SO, WHAT ARE YOU ALSO KIND OF POINTING OUT, IT'S NOT JUST THE FACT THAT WE COULD GET A MEDICINE IN, BUT THERE'S THIS WHOLISTIC APPROACH, WHEN YOU LOOK AT WHAT MAKES A PERSON SICK.

IF YOU DECREASES YOUR CHANCES OF HIV TRANSMISSION, OR IABETES, YOU ARE GOING TO DECREASE YOUR CHANCES OF DYING FROM TUBERCULOSIS.

THOSE ARE ALL KIND OF BIG SOVIET SOCIETAL ISSUES TO WRAP OUR HEADS AROUND.

>> WE CAN'T SEPARATE ANY DISEASE OF INJUSTICE FROM ITS BIOMEDICAL NATURE AND SOCIAL NATURE.

I ARGUE IN THE BOOK THAT THE WAY WE IMAGINE ILLNESS IS JUST AS IMPORTANT AS THE NATURE OF THE ILLNESS ITSELF, BECAUSE WE ARE VERY POWERFUL AS A SPECIES, AND SO, HOW WE IMAGINE ILLNESS SHAPES HOW PEOPLE LIVE AND DIE OF THOSE ILLNESSES, BUT IT ALSO SHAPES WHO ENDS UP LIVING AND DYING OF THOSE ILLNESSES.

>> SO, WHAT DO YOU SEE AS A WAY KIND OF FORWARD?

OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, YOU ARE ON A BOOK TOUR RIGHT NOW, AND YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THIS, WHAT DO YOU HOPE PEOPLE TAKE AWAY?

>> WELL, I HOPE PEOPLE FEEL HOPEFUL AT THE END OF THE BOOK, WHICH, I KNOW IS A LITTLE BIT HARD TO COME BY FOR A LOT OF FOLKS RIGHT NOW, BUT I REALLY WANTED TO WRITE A HOPEFUL BOOK, BECAUSE I THINK THE STORY OF TUBERCULOSIS IS HOPEFUL, AND THAT IT CAN BE MORE HOPEFUL.

YOU KNOW, THE YEAR I GRADUATED FROM HIGH SCHOOL, ABOUT 2.

7 MILLION PEOPLE DIED FROM TUBERCULOSIS.

LAST YEAR, 1.

25 MILLION DID.

NOW, ALL OF THOSE DEATHS WERE NEEDLESS, BUT THE FACT THAT WE'VE REDUED THE DEATHS BY OVER 50% SINCE I GRADUATED FROM HIGH SCHOOL SHOULD BE A SOURCE OF HOPE FOR US, BECAUSE THAT PROGRESS WASN'T NATURAL, IT WASN'T INEVITABLE, IT WASN'T ALWAYS GOING TO HAPPEN.

IT HAPPENED BECAUSE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE, INCLUDING MILLIONS OF TAXPAYERS, CAME TOGETHER TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN AND TOGETHER, WE ACCOMPLISHED SOMETHING EXTRAORDINARY.

NOW, WE CAN REDUCE TUBERCULOSIS BY ANOTHER 50%, OR 99%, IF WE WANT TO, BUT WE HAVE TO DECIDE THAT WE WANT TO.

WE HAVE TO DECIDE THAT WE'RE GOING TO VALUE THE LIVES OF PEOPLE WHO ARE LIKELY TO GET TUBERCULOSIS, JUST AS WE WOULD VALUE MY BROTHER'S LIFE, OR MY LIFE.

>> AND SO, HOW DO YOU CONVINCE GOVERNMENTS, HOSPITALS, COMMUNITIES, TO TAKE THIS SERIOUSLY?

BECAUSE, IN A WAY, OBVIOUSLY, THE WHOLE WORLD PAID ATTENTION TO COVID, AS THEY RIGHTFULLY SHOULD HAVE, BUT TUBERCULOSIS, AS YOU POINT OUT, IS KILLING MORE PEOPLE ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN, WHY WE JUST KIND OF LET IT DRIFT.

>> YEAH, WE ACCEPT IT.

BUT WE DON'T HAVE TO.

I THINK HUMAN ATTENTION IS INCREDIBLY POWERFUL.

WHEN WE PAY ATTENTION TO PROBLEMS, WE ARE FAR MORE LIKELY TO SOLVE THEM.

THINK OF THE WAY THAT WE --THINK OF WHEN WE STARTED PAYING ATTENTION TO, IN THE RICH WORLD, TO THE PROBLEM OF IV/AIDS IN IMPOVERISHED COMMUNITIES.

WE'VE SAVED OVER 25 MILLION LIVES IN THE LAST 20 YEARS.

IT'S AN INCREDIBLE ACCOMPLISHMENT.

IF WE CAN HAVE A SIMILAR SUPPORT FOR TUBERCULOSIS, WE CAN SEE SIMILAR RESULTS, IF WE FUND THINGS LIKE THE GLOBAL FUND, IF WE FUND THINGS LIKE USAID, IF OTHER COUNTRIES STEP UP AND HELP US IN THAT FIGHT, ALL OF THAT CAN COME TOGETHER TO LEAD TO A WORLD WITHOUT TUBERCULOSIS, BUT IT DOES REQUIRE POLITICAL WILL AND RESOURCES.

>> THE BOOK IS CALLED "EVERYTHING IS TUBERCULOSIS. "

JOHN GREEN, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANK YOU, HARI.